It's not unethical to download the album if you've already pre-ordered copies or are planning to buy it. Like the majority of folks here, I too have the leaked version. But I'm also paying for an offical copy along with my movie theatre ticket on the 6th. As a fan I need to have the whole package with the artwork, liner notes, and lyrics. A new Hip album just wouldn't be the same without that stuff.
The Darkest Canuck Wrote:I download music or movies, and it's stealing, but companies overcharge us in every way possible, for everything that they possibly can, and that's ok though ,it's just business, the way of the world, ect...definately not stealing...that's ok, i don't believe in the ten commandments or any of that jazz anyway...just chaos, that's all that there is, and all that there ever will be, just chaos...mankind thinks that he can defeat the chaos with all of his rules and institutions, but really, he is only defeating himself, and turning a blind eye to not only his inevitable extinction, but to his own humble savage beginnings and nature.
What guidelines do use to determine that companies overcharge? This concept has no merit. If someone is willing to pay, then they were not overcharged.
Downloading media illegally is theft of intellectual property. If this continues, and governments are not able to control it then the quantity and quality of emerging bands will diminish. Their music will net them no profit and they will not be able to continue to pursue their careers...
I wonder how many great bands would come out of pure communism?
How many great books would be published if everyone downloaded the texts the day of their release?
I'm sure The Hip aren't exactly hurting for cash, but they created this album, it is theirs, and they spent a lot of money doing so. This album also helps pay the salary of hundreds of individuals on down the line who aren't rock stars, who may very well be living paycheck to paycheck.
For all you that have been buying concert tickets and albums of The Hip's for years and have already purchased the cd through the concert tickets I can understand why you think you're entitled to listen. Unfortunately though, you lend yourself to the culture of piracy and piracy is the enemy of innovation and creativity of all kinds.
like i said in the wats thread, every hip album since phantom power has leaked online, albeit its become much faster then it was back in those days. and it seems the hip are doing well for themselves still. i would say that 95% of hip fans are die hard hip fans and would support them no matter what. the hip leaks are never huge as say the new metallica record or what have you, so most of the people downloading it are hardcore fans. as much as ive tried to get people to listen to the hip, they dont and thats sad because most of them arent canadian and just dont get the hip. they're canadiana at its finest.
Looking over The Hip's album sales, albeit outdated ones, it would be hard to argue that piracy and sharing doesn't have at least something to do with the decline. How many people go together with a friend or two to buy a cd and then share it? The die hards may be more likely to download it, but they're also more likely to buy it as well. It's the casual, web savvy fans that don't buy it, they don't need to.
As of November 8, 2005
The Tragically Hip (1987) 350,000
Up To Here (1989) 1,250,000
Road Apples (1991) 935,000
Fully Completely (1992) 1,035,000
Day for Night (1994) 780,000
Trouble At The Henhouse (1996) 575,000
Live Between Us (1997) 375,000
Phantom Power (1998) 405,000
Music @ Work (2000) 210,000
In Violet Light (2002) 130,000
In Between Evolution (2004) 101,000
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those figures are weird because you need to adjust for time. I wonder what the count is now...
I already explained myself in the other thread but... Hahahah, go ahead and contact The Pirate Bay. They will laugh in your face. Also: once the album drops and you get it, listen to "The Depression Suite" and tell me a few weeks of giult wouldn't have been worth it to hear that song. It's the best thing they've written in almost a decade, basically.
I'LL BE DRIVEN, MY EYES ALWAYS MOVIN'
I'LL BE RIVETED TO THE TASK
NO SMILING, THAT'S IMPORTANT
I WILL MAKE MY FACE A MASK
stanslow12 Wrote:Downloading media illegally is theft of intellectual property. If this continues, and governments are not able to control it then the quantity and quality of emerging bands will diminish. Their music will net them no profit and they will not be able to continue to pursue their careers...
I'm pretty sure internet distribution and piracy have been shown to be good for all but the biggest of bands (top selling 25%). Independent artists have much more potential for exposure these days and as a result their business is booming. It's the bigger names and therefore the bigger labels who are suffering, and since they have the financial and political pull, we hear all about this TERRIBLE PROBLEM which is KILLING (the corporate) MUSIC (industry). "Music" as it were is virtually without profit for most artists anyway - it's all in the touring and merch sales. And while, admittedly, those are somewhat influenced by the radio play/promotion that comes with being on a major label, the internet is becoming a damn fine substitute.
Also, I suspect that less people are buying Hip albums because less people care about the Hip.
The Heron Outside Wrote:Roy-at-tth Wrote:I'm pretty sure MAv and the boys aren't gonna like the leak very much...
How do you figure? Two weeks is barely a leak, considering copies of the record are usually sent to radio stations, media outlets, etc. for review a few weeks before the release date. How else would you drum up excitement? These days, 2 weeks isn't so bad at all. Leaks are inevitable.
They (Hip, management, etc) know that the album will leak. Why do you think there are so many preorder options? And so many options to spend money? It's to offset the lost sales due to downloading.
as for those sales figures...downloading etc. may play into it slightly, but I'd wager it has wayyyy more to do with the quality of the albums in the eyes of the casual fans...i.e. when's the last time the hip wrote a song that was as popular as ABAC? As well, with the demise of the music video channel, exposure has been cut in a big way. While many of us dig all of the hip's albums, to the casual fan, what was the last "gotta buy" hip album?
I'll buy it anyway, already put my pre order in. But I do want to listen to this :music
WesleyC. Wrote:Uh I must confess, I had the urge to download it but I DID NOT!!!! Can someone see if this can get shut down. Its really not right to have ppl downloading it for free. <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4789105/we_are_the_same_tragically_hip-----____harris">http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4789105 ... ____harris</a><!-- m -->
<<less than two hours later>>
WesleyC. Wrote:Ok so call me a lemming, I went and got it and am listening to it right now.
Guess I better go and buy the LP now or im a total shit head.
I think this is perhaps the most comical thing I've ever seen posted here.
just out of curiosity, is there any other way of getting my hands on the leaked version without having to download it off of pirate bay?
direwolf74 Wrote:It's not unethical to download the album if you've already pre-ordered copies or are planning to buy it.
That completely depends on your personal code of ethics.
Mind you, I'm not judging yours - I'm just saying that the above statement is not 'universally true'.
cferneyh Wrote:WesleyC. Wrote:Uh I must confess, I had the urge to download it but I DID NOT!!!! Can someone see if this can get shut down. Its really not right to have ppl downloading it for free. <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4789105/we_are_the_same_tragically_hip-----____harris">http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4789105 ... ____harris</a><!-- m -->
<<less than two hours later>>
WesleyC. Wrote:Ok so call me a lemming, I went and got it and am listening to it right now.
Guess I better go and buy the LP now or im a total shit head.
I think this is perhaps the most comical thing I've ever seen posted here.
The CFern is BACK!!!
If Im reading this correctly, you can copy music but you cant share it?
From the Copyright Act of Canada:
Copying for Private Use
Where no infringement of copyright
80. (1) Subject to subsection (2), the act of reproducing all or any substantial part of
(a) a musical work embodied in a sound recording,
(b) a performer’s performance of a musical work embodied in a sound recording, or
© a sound recording in which a musical work, or a performer’s performance of a musical work, is embodied
onto an audio recording medium for the private use of the person who makes the copy does not constitute an infringement of the copyright in the musical work, the performer’s performance or the sound recording.
Limitation
(2) Subsection (1) does not apply if the act described in that subsection is done for the purpose of doing any of the following in relation to any of the things referred to in paragraphs (1)(a) to ©:
(a) selling or renting out, or by way of trade exposing or offering for sale or rental;
(b) distributing, whether or not for the purpose of trade;
© communicating to the public by telecommunication; or
(d) performing, or causing to be performed, in public.
1997, c. 24, s. 50.