[grimes]

Also, is the steroid use a known fact? Shouldn't that disqualify him from playing?

Well, that's the issue. The steriod use is not a "fact" in the sense that he has never tested positive for anything. Major League Baseball has, until recently, simply turned a blind eye to steroid use. Prior to 2002, they did not test players for performance-enhancing drugs at all. The testing system in place from 2002 to 2005 was a joke. Since then they have bowed to public pressure and enacted more serious testing programs, and penalties for positive tests, however they still fall well below the standards used by the World Anti-Doping Agency.

[VioletlightHeron]

he has refused for years to take part in the home run derby...even a month ago when it was in SF...his reason is "im a grown man and i dont have to do things i dont want to"

A baseball columnist I was reading awhile back (can't remember who it was) or what newspaper) said the reason Bonds doesnt participate in the HR derby is because it is an exhibition, no elbow armor or anything like that is allowed, which would make it less likely that Barry would be able to blast dingers out of the park and he simply doesnt want to get shown up by other players. It's a very childish reason to not participate.

[tommygunn]

One stunning example is his current stance concerning the Hall of Fame. As of now, Bonds will not donate his uniform or other artifacts once he is voted in.

Who says he'll get voted in? It's quite possible he won't. :thumb:

[The Darkest Canuck]

buddy in Japan has 868 hr's...he's the real king...just like all those Japanese Elvis impersonators .

[grimes]

One stunning example is his current stance concerning the Hall of Fame. As of now, Bonds will not donate his uniform or other artifacts once he is voted in.

Who says he'll get voted in? It's quite possible he won't. :thumb:

The only way he won't get in is if the grand jury comes back with some charges against him. Otherwise, his numbers make him a lock, no matter how much we all dislike him.

[tommygunn]

One stunning example is his current stance concerning the Hall of Fame. As of now, Bonds will not donate his uniform or other artifacts once he is voted in.

Who says he'll get voted in? It's quite possible he won't. :thumb:

The only way he won't get in is if the grand jury comes back with some charges against him. Otherwise, his numbers make him a lock, no matter how much we all dislike him.

Well, it's not us or the Grand Jury that decides if he gets in the HOF or not. It's the Baseball Writers Association of America who decides, the same people with whom he's had such a fabulous relationship with over the years. :lol:

The BBWAA could treat Bonds the same as they did McGwire. :wink:

[The Horrible Esthete]

But never will I say "good for Barry", because he is a Grade-A asshole.

I've heard this quite a bit lately - it's the standard second line after "Barry Bonds broke Hank Aaron's homerun record." I have to admit that I don't know Bonds from a hole in the ground. Do you think he's an asshole because of the steroid use or is there something else?

Also, is the steroid use a known fact? Shouldn't that disqualify him from playing?

Sorry for the lame questions. I don't really follow baseball but I'm interested in all the dislike of Bonds.

Asking questions is never 'lame' in my book.

I certainly don't like the fact that so many MLB players allegedly used steroids (it was supposedly rampant from around 1995-2003). But I don't blame the players as much as I do MLB iteself and its Commissioner (Bud Selig); MLB officials had to know what was going on, and chose to turn a blind eye because the scoring (homeruns) were drawing record crowds to the ballparks.

No, I've disliked Barry for years -- since long before the steroid issue even surfaced. Jenna covered the reason pretty well. The guy is reknown for being a jerk to teammates, clubhouse attendants, and fans. There are so many accounts of this that I cannot begin to name them all. He has snubbed young kids and even opposing players for seeking autographs for their own kids, he has berated teenage clubhouse attendants for not having x-number of clean towels in the right place for him, he has been absent from on-field team celebrations after important, thrilling victories because he only wanted to get dressed and leave the ballpark, he has answered reporters' questions with the most scathing scarcasm and self-importance you'll ever hear -- the list is a mile long.

[chris]

Don't forget the fact that he has his own chair in the dugout... can't sit on the bench with the rest of the players.

[sherpahigh]

[grimes]

Well, it's not us or the Grand Jury that decides if he gets in the HOF or not. It's the Baseball Writers Association of America who decides, the same people with whom he's had such a fabulous relationship with over the years. :lol:

The BBWAA could treat Bonds the same as they did McGwire. :wink:

I think that's wishful thinking. At least with McGwire, you could make a case that his overall career stats simply aren't HOF material. You can't say the same about Bonds. His numbers are just too good, the BBWAA will have no choice but to vote him in. Maybe he'll get the first-ballot snub, but after that he'll be in I have no doubt.

[tommygunn]

Well, it's not us or the Grand Jury that decides if he gets in the HOF or not. It's the Baseball Writers Association of America who decides, the same people with whom he's had such a fabulous relationship with over the years. :lol:

The BBWAA could treat Bonds the same as they did McGwire. :wink:

I think that's wishful thinking. At least with McGwire, you could make a case that his overall career stats simply aren't HOF material. You can't say the same about Bonds. His numbers are just too good, the BBWAA will have no choice but to vote him in. Maybe he'll get the first-ballot snub, but after that he'll be in I have no doubt.

McGwire's career stats are great and indeed HOF worthy. His 583 career homers alone attest to that. Don't forget, he was also voted onto the MLB All-Century Team!

But, the BBWAA doesn't just look at #'s when deciding whether a player is deserving or not.
Has Bonds really 'served the sport' well? Due to the steroid controversy, many (most?) would say no.

I've read a few articles these last few days where writers have said they won't vote Bonds in when he becomes eligible...

[grimes]

Hey I agree Big Mac deserves to be in there. The writers really screwed him, especially considering how much they were all behind him in 1998. Now they all act is if the whole steroids thing was a shock to them...give me a break. The fact is though with a career batting average of .263 and only 1,626 hits, I can see how people could make an argument that he doesn't deserve to be in based on merit, the 583 homers aside. Bonds however, the all-time home run leader, whose career average is a shade below .300, is also closing in on 3,000 hits, and stole 500 bases in his day. Not to mention the 7 MVP awards and 8 gold gloves. As much as everyone loves to hate him, unless he's banned from baseball outright like Pete Rose or Shoeless Joe (which could happen if they ever found proof of steroid use), I can't see how he won't be in the hall of fame.

[The Horrible Esthete]

I agree with grimes about Bonds. He was HoF material without the "cartoon numbers" he was putting up in his mid & late 30s. He is without question one of the greatest EVER, steroids or not. Though local HoF sportswriter Hal McCoy said he's never going to vote for Barry based on integrity issues....

McGwire, on the other hand, is a different story. When you're a career .263 hittin 1B, and all you have to make yor case is a 583 HR total which is HIGHLY SUSPECT, (no MVP's, and only 1 Gold Glove & 3 Silver Slugger Awards), you aren't looking too good. It be a very different story if he had posted those numbers in the 50s, 60s, or 70's, but the past 25 years have ushered in a completely new set of standards.

[Sam]

Thanks for filling me in on Bonds. It sounds like he's the inspiration for that movie that Bernie Mac made a few years ago called Mr. 3000. This part from Jenna really sounds like the movie:

One stunning example is his current stance concerning the Hall of Fame. As of now, Bonds will not donate his uniform or other artifacts once he is voted in. He plans to sell them for figures in the millions.

I wonder if Bonds has considered suing the movie producers for copyright infringement?

I'm surprised that MLB (I actually had to google "MLB" because I didn't know what the letters stood for) didn't start testing for steroid use until 2002. I suppose that the use of performance enhancing drugs is more accepted (or at least overlooked) in professional sports than it is in amateur sports.