[tigerthelion]

If you think 36 points in 82 games and minus 6 on a playoff team, and 0 points in 7 playoff games is "great", then Trevor Linden is indeed "great".

Proves my point.

there's a lot more that he brings then just points..granted his playoff production wasn't great, but he puts his heart on the ice every night...he never takes a night off...

cratch:

Dude, I went to dozens of Canuck games when I lived in Vcr and there were plenty of games where he was completely invisible. He takes a night off now and again like most NHLers do.

He's a washed up bum and has been for about a decade now.

But I do love when someone doesn't have any numbers to back up their position so they use the ever mysterious "intangibles" and statements like "he puts his heart on the ice every night". I'm gonna use one of those lines the next time the wife is pissed with me.

Wife: You forgot to take out the garbage last night and now the kitchen stinks.

Me: Maybe, but dammit, when I do take out the garbage, I put my heart into it. When I'm taking out the garbage, I do the little things that a lot of people don't notice. Oh sure, you could have married someone who takes out the garbage all the time and never forgets, but would he have done it with heart? Would he have done it with grit? I don't think so. Those pretty boys don't know the first thing about heart because remembering to take out the garbage comes too easy for them. I have to work at it, which makes me appreciate it more when I do remember.

Good post. I don't think Linden is that good either.

It's funny when people mention "intangibles" and "heart" and "work ethic" and my personal favourite "two way player". I was on the Canucks forum today. Someone said Chubarov signed in Russia. To my surprise, most Nuck fans thought he was great. I couldn't believe what I was hearing. I read how he "worked hard" and "killed penalties" and had "heart". Someone even said he gets "timely goals". Um... Chubarov pretty much sucks and always has sucked. He's so replaceable it's not enough funny. Anyway, yeah....I prefer results over "hard work" and "intagibles". After all, I thought Mike Keane was going to put Vancouver over the top last year.

[Dr. J]

Meatheaduzzi just took it too far. It should have ended with the fight. That is the way it used to be in the NHL

and that's part of the problem. A professional sport that condones violence (fighting) as a means of relieving tension, settling scores and intimidating/motivating others is never going to be able to draw the line and deal effectively with those who cross it.

Bertuzzi is a perfect example. The guy was suspended 3 games in '96 for punching a linesman. He was suspended 10 games in '01 for leaving the bench to attack an opponent and then chases some guy around the ice for the purpose of pounding him over something that supposedly had been settled. It was not a heat of the moment action!

If the NHL wants to call itself a professional sport, for crissakes step up and deal with some of this shit.

Suspending Bertuzzi for a season that never existed is a joke. Hell, he was suspended 15 games for kicking another player in Jr. A.

[j-monster]

Bertuzzi is lucky he's considered to be a star player.

If it was Wade Brookbank, or whatever goon the Canucks have on their roster, who injured Moore, he would have been kicked out of the NHL so fast his head would still be spinning today.

But Bert is a star player and a marquee name in a major Canadian hockey market, so he gets reinstated.

If the NHL had played last year, then reinstating him now would have represented an appropriate punishment. As it is, he gets, what, 20 games for his actions? Not nearly enough. He shouldn't get credit for time served for an NHL season which never existed in the first place!

Although I guess expecting a fair decision in this case was pretty ridiculous... I mean it is Bettman we're talking about. Bettman did a great job delivering the salary cap to the owners, but about the sport of hockey he's freaking clueless and should step down now for the good of the game and install a commissioner who actually knows hockey.

[NMAS]

I think it has to be pointed out that Bertuzzi was banned from playing in Europe during the lockout by the European hockey authorities. The guy wasn't able to make a living playing hockey for a whole year while others were. He's served his time and he's profusely apologized over and over again. What more do you want?

Make a living? That's HILARIOUS. Yeah, the $200K that he would have made in Europe - if he went - sure would have put the food in his family's mouths that the millions in the bank couldn't have.

Some guys make it seem that everyone went over and played in Europe, but in reality not that many did, there are 750 ( est) players in the NHL, I think something like 250 went over and played in Europe. I could be wrong on those numbers, but there is far more guys that didn't make any money this year than did make money. Bertuzzi is just one of those guys that didn't make money. He should still be sitting.

[tigerthelion]

Bertuzzi is lucky he's considered to be a star player.

If it was Wade Brookbank, or whatever goon the Canucks have on their roster, who injured Moore, he would have been kicked out of the NHL so fast his head would still be spinning today.

But Bert is a star player and a marquee name in a major Canadian hockey market, so he gets reinstated.

If the NHL had played last year, then reinstating him now would have represented an appropriate punishment. As it is, he gets, what, 20 games for his actions? Not nearly enough. He shouldn't get credit for time served for an NHL season which never existed in the first place!

Although I guess expecting a fair decision in this case was pretty ridiculous... I mean it is Bettman we're talking about. Bettman did a great job delivering the salary cap to the owners, but about the sport of hockey he's freaking clueless and should step down now for the good of the game and install a commissioner who actually knows hockey.

But the stars have ALWAYS been treated differently. Is it fair that Wayne Gretzky got to play his ENTIRE CAREER UNTOUCHED? How is that fair to other guys who have to fight through holding and grabbing and slashing and spearing to find free space to roam and score. Stars are always treated differently. Do you think Palffy is going to have as much open ice as Crosby?? Seriously, the stars sell the game. Letting Gretzky roam freely to set records and score without being touched is every bit as bad as letting a star off easily on a suspension. It's NEVER BEEN A FAIR PLAYING FIELD AND IT NEVER WILL BECAUSE STARS SELL THE GAME!!

[The Darkest Canuck]

if you don't think missing the oppertunity to win the Stanley Cup, the chance to represent your country, and to make a living abroad during the lockout, is a harsh penalty, you suck. What Moore did to Naslund went completely unpunished, and was every bit as potentially dangerous. I'm not defending BErtuzzi's actions, but what goes around comes around, and it most certainly came back to Moore...who was nothing but a young punk trying to make a name for himself by laying out one of the best players in the league.

[cferneyh]

if you don't think missing the oppertunity to win the Stanley Cup, the chance to represent your country, and to make a living abroad during the lockout, is a harsh penalty, you suck. What Moore did to Naslund went completely unpunished, and was every bit as potentially dangerous. I'm not defending BErtuzzi's actions, but what goes around comes around, and it most certainly came back to Moore...who was nothing but a young punk trying to make a name for himself by laying out one of the best players in the league.

Yeah, in that split second before Moore hit Naslund (an unpenalized play) he thought to himself: "this is my chance to make a name for myself!!!!" :roll:

You are probably one of those clowns who thought that Draper wanted his face rearranged by Claude Lemieux so he intentionally put himself in a prone position to be hit from behind.

[j-monster]

Bertuzzi is lucky he's considered to be a star player.

If it was Wade Brookbank, or whatever goon the Canucks have on their roster, who injured Moore, he would have been kicked out of the NHL so fast his head would still be spinning today.

But Bert is a star player and a marquee name in a major Canadian hockey market, so he gets reinstated.

If the NHL had played last year, then reinstating him now would have represented an appropriate punishment. As it is, he gets, what, 20 games for his actions? Not nearly enough. He shouldn't get credit for time served for an NHL season which never existed in the first place!

Although I guess expecting a fair decision in this case was pretty ridiculous... I mean it is Bettman we're talking about. Bettman did a great job delivering the salary cap to the owners, but about the sport of hockey he's freaking clueless and should step down now for the good of the game and install a commissioner who actually knows hockey.

But the stars have ALWAYS been treated differently. Is it fair that Wayne Gretzky got to play his ENTIRE CAREER UNTOUCHED? How is that fair to other guys who have to fight through holding and grabbing and slashing and spearing to find free space to roam and score. Stars are always treated differently. Do you think Palffy is going to have as much open ice as Crosby?? Seriously, the stars sell the game. Letting Gretzky roam freely to set records and score without being touched is every bit as bad as letting a star off easily on a suspension. It's NEVER BEEN A FAIR PLAYING FIELD AND IT NEVER WILL BECAUSE STARS SELL THE GAME!!

I think you're comparing apples and oranges here.

Gretzky never cheap-shotted and jumped a guy from behind to break bones in his neck like Bertuzzi did. So to compare Gretzky's situation to Bertuzzi does not make sense.

You are right in saying that stars sell the game... but stars who sell the game and flagrantly break the rules like Bert did should be punished appropriately. Star status (or lack thereof) shouldn't matter when dealing with violent incidents like Bert's attack on Moore.