[mcwslc]

hmm, i'm a little concerned. i've not heard it, but "putting down" is one of the low moments in the hip's career. a real "paint by numbers" rock song and it is so not what they're about.

wish we could use puretacks in europe.

...amen.

Hearing that it sounds like 'Puttin Down' or 'Are you Ready?' just ruined my weekend. However I must say, I don't think I've ever heard a hip "sounds like...." comparison that I've ever agreed with. I haven't heard 'summer' yet so maybe that streak will be broken, but I hope not!

To each his own, each album has a few clunkers, except Road Apples...IMPO. I'm always surprised at what songs people love and which ones they hate. Reading that some folks want 'The Rules' again in concert is a real head scratcher for me?

[Kim]

I completely disagree with the people above as well...both singles are excellent to me...and moreover SIKU blows VS out of the water. If you aren't obsessed with SIKU by now, then you're doing something wrong as a hip fan.

Let's not go around telling people they're "doing something wrong", come on. Different people, different tastes, that's the way I see it. Although SIKU has grown on me and I kinda like it now, I am not obsessed by it and still think VS is better.

[vicariousmartyr]

If you aren't obsessed with SIKU by now, then you're doing something wrong as a hip fan.

????? cratch:
thats a rather unjustified and ballsy statement...

[Shazbot]

That said, I am worried about IBE myself. Unlike you, I am having a disturbingly hard time with VS; it just isn't clicking for me, and I fear I will agree with your assessment of SIKU.

Here's my beef with VS:

The chord progressions for the verses are identical to that of the chorus, rendering them virtually indistinguishable from one another (aside from the vocals / lyrics). The result (for me) is a rather mundane cut. The Hip have a propensity for doing this, and I’m not sure I like it. One of the great things about this band, though, is that they can “save” a track with expertly-conceived bridgework, and this quality may be the saving grace for VS.

Anywho, I hope IBE will not disappoint. I think IVL was lacking in areas, too, and pray that it doesn’t wind up marking the beginning of the end of this band’s genius.

You're not alone in not liking VS. I think it starts out with a terrific rhythm and energy, but the vocals are meandering and there's no real hook to it. The Hip used to always have very memorable, even catchy songs, though not in the sense of typical pop radio, which is what made them so cool. But except for two or three gems, IVL was lacking in memorable songs, and so far VS isn't a great indication of IBE. I haven't heard SIKU yet, though, and I'm actually encouraged to hear it from how people have described it. I don't know if it's a memorable track, but it sounds like an interesting one, at least, whereas VS just kind of meanders and chugs along and doesn't really go anywhere or do much for me at all. Very disappointing if that's supposed to be the lead track from the album.

Anyway, I'll still be buying the album, and I'm sure I'll like it, or at least some songs from it, regardless. 8)

[thedarkcanuck]

perhaps the greatest thing about the hip is that every one of their songs is cherished by a large number of people ...thats 17 yrs of songs

[gibbytime39]

i love VS and so far SIKU is growing. for IVL most of the tunes didn't sink in till i seen them live. seeing them performed live always brings the song into focus. but negative comments are good because it kind of turns your stomach when some posts start with "instant classic."
{or words to that effect} its like if gord farted the comment would be "did that smell like a rose or what?" or "was that the best fart ever." hers to hoping we never have to smell gord's farts. out.

[The Horrible Esthete]

By the way, if you listen closely to the chorus of Vaccination Scar, there is most definitely a change in the chord progression. Not a huge one, but enough to distinguish it from the verses. Just my opinion of course.

I stand corrected Casey; you are absolutely right about that. The chords identified below are merely simplified root-chords....there are several slight variations of each that are easy to detect in the intro:

Verse:
[-----------B-----------][----------G----------][--------------A-------------][---------------B----------------]
So the chemistry's set, and I'm not the saddest cheerleader to forget the American word.......(Repeated throughout)

Chorus:
[----------G-----------][-------A--------][------G------][-------------A-------------][-----G-----][-----------A----------][------B------]
If there's one thing I remember is his tear on your bare shoulder, this little silver boulder, this slowly falling star.

As you can see, the chorus differs only in that the vocals start it in G, and the B is dropped in the sequence so that the progression alternates between G and A (instead of B, G, and A) until the end of the measure when it returns to B.....

Yeah....too much info., I know, but my point is that the song is mundane to me, and its due to the fact that there is little variation thought the song (except for the bridges)....

[thechubb]

wait, your worried about VS because you cant identify with the rythms and chord progressions? the hip have said without reservation that they are not a radio friendly band because they do not follow the standard verse chorus repetitions of most bands. these are the reasons we love the hip. they refuse to buy into the formulas necessary to make in main stream radio. VS may not be little bones. But, it highlights Robs abilities better than anything we've seen in years. Listen to IVL, no guitar solos. VS features some great slide guitar ala Blow. Summer may not seem to have a great hook yet. But, I remember when DFN came out. How many listens did it take to "get it". Grace, too. This song is in gords words, " a very complex tune". I have a feeling, based on the very small amount I have heard from this record, that we can expect more of the very complex lyrical and musical experimentation from the band.

[thedarkcanuck]

totally agree...listened to summer about 30 times or more now and i think i like it more than vs...so now i am really pumped for the album!(as if i wasn`t before)

[arseface88]

First let me say that I really like this song, but also it really feels like Gord's solo stuff. I mean to hear the riffs under Gord's strumming, you really have to listen closely.

[tigerthelion]

I like the song. Like most people said, the first listen doesn't do it justice. I can only assume that Gordie knows he's a bit out of his range in this one but he sings it without a care. Maybe the strained voice is intended to portray a band just beginning on its journey to stardom, and just putting every ounce of energy into the music without worrying about every little thing the critics may notice.

I like the off kiltered nature of the music. It is the exact opposite sound of what you hear on the radio. A good example is "The Reason" by Hoobastank which is so simply structured and look at the success of the song. It's actually number one on Puretracks. I'll take The Hip and their thoughtful music over that stuff any day. Now I don't know whether the Hip have much say in the singles or if it is the label because the Hip must know that it probably won't be a big hit to non-Hip fans. It's almost like they don't care if they make any headway in the US and I love it!

[thecompletist]

I like the song. Like most people said, the first listen doesn't do it justice. I can only assume that Gordie knows he's a bit out of his range in this one but he sings it without a care. Maybe the strained voice is intended to portray a band just beginning on its journey to stardom, and just putting every ounce of energy into the music without worrying about every little thing the critics may notice.

I like the off kiltered nature of the music. It is the exact opposite sound of what you hear on the radio. A good example is "The Reason" by Hoobastank which is so simply structured and look at the success of the song. It's actually number one on Puretracks. I'll take The Hip and their thoughtful music over that stuff any day. Now I don't know whether the Hip have much say in the singles or if it is the label because the Hip must know that it probably won't be a big hit to non-Hip fans. It's almost like they don't care if they make any headway in the US and I love it!

I agree with what you've written above. I am one of those "who cares" if no-one else figures out how great this band is beyond the NOIS, Little Bones, Poets and other radio friendly songs. I've always tended to skip those lead tracks on every album since i hear them on the radio all the time. Tiger the Lion, The Completists, Train Overnight, Vapour Trails are just a few tunes we'd never hear on the local rock stations.... but those are the tunes I really dig. Now neither of these new tunes are reminding me of those yet after 15+ listens... but I like Scar & SKU us still growing... how much more will i like it by the end of the summer? Who knows... I never saw The Darkest One creep up on me like it did until 6 months after IVL was released. It for me was one I ennjoyed the few times I heard it on the radio... it was like it belonged there... almost fallen off of Road Apples or something.

Scar is a straight up safe - rocker with some old school slide that makes it nice to listen too along with with Paul's vocals over top of Gord.... where Summer is a different animal that may find itself getting attention during the live shows. I don't think Gord will have the problems people have mentioned nailing this one live! The pauses and backing vocals by Sinclair are a decent mix.

All in all I'll say what one or 2 others did... Listen to it loud and or on headphones so you can hear everything that is being offered... even still we all know these are not likely the strongest songs on the upcoming release.

Let's all come back in 2 months and vote on what the "SINGLES" should have been. It will be interesting.

- thecompletist

[direwolf74]

wait, your worried about VS because you cant identify with the rythms and chord progressions? the hip have said without reservation that they are not a radio friendly band because they do not follow the standard verse chorus repetitions of most bands. these are the reasons we love the hip. they refuse to buy into the formulas necessary to make in main stream radio. VS may not be little bones. But, it highlights Robs abilities better than anything we've seen in years. Listen to IVL, no guitar solos. VS features some great slide guitar ala Blow. Summer may not seem to have a great hook yet. But, I remember when DFN came out. How many listens did it take to "get it". Grace, too. This song is in gords words, " a very complex tune". I have a feeling, based on the very small amount I have heard from this record, that we can expect more of the very complex lyrical and musical experimentation from the band.

What he said.

[direwolf74]

I like the song. Like most people said, the first listen doesn't do it justice. I can only assume that Gordie knows he's a bit out of his range in this one but he sings it without a care. Maybe the strained voice is intended to portray a band just beginning on its journey to stardom, and just putting every ounce of energy into the music without worrying about every little thing the critics may notice.

I like the off kiltered nature of the music. It is the exact opposite sound of what you hear on the radio. A good example is "The Reason" by Hoobastank which is so simply structured and look at the success of the song. It's actually number one on Puretracks. I'll take The Hip and their thoughtful music over that stuff any day. Now I don't know whether the Hip have much say in the singles or if it is the label because the Hip must know that it probably won't be a big hit to non-Hip fans. It's almost like they don't care if they make any headway in the US and I love it!

I agree with what you've written above. I am one of those "who cares" if no-one else figures out how great this band is beyond the NOIS, Little Bones, Poets and other radio friendly songs. I've always tended to skip those lead tracks on every album since i hear them on the radio all the time. Tiger the Lion, The Completists, Train Overnight, Vapour Trails are just a few tunes we'd never hear on the local rock stations.... but those are the tunes I really dig. Now neither of these new tunes are reminding me of those yet after 15+ listens... but I like Scar & SKU us still growing... how much more will i like it by the end of the summer? Who knows... I never saw The Darkest One creep up on me like it did until 6 months after IVL was released. It for me was one I ennjoyed the few times I heard it on the radio... it was like it belonged there... almost fallen off of Road Apples or something.

Scar is a straight up safe - rocker with some old school slide that makes it nice to listen too along with with Paul's vocals over top of Gord.... where Summer is a different animal that may find itself getting attention during the live shows. I don't think Gord will have the problems people have mentioned nailing this one live! The pauses and backing vocals by Sinclair are a decent mix.

All in all I'll say what one or 2 others did... Listen to it loud and or on headphones so you can hear everything that is being offered... even still we all know these are not likely the strongest songs on the upcoming release.

Let's all come back in 2 months and vote on what the "SINGLES" should have been. It will be interesting.

- thecompletist

I couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks, guys!

[tigerthelion]

I've listened to SKS a few more times. The music is great in my opinion. Having said that, I kind of hope this is the only song on the record where Gord sings this way. It is a little painful to listen to at times but overall the song succeeds. I just don't want to hear Gord that far out of his range on much more than one song, like Phantom Power. It is a really good record and I like Thompson Girl but Gord is just hanging on in the "grunt...............etc" part. It's all right in moderation but if there are two or three or four songs where Gord is struggling I'll be a bit dissapointed.

With all that said, I agree with thecompletist that these are probably not the two strongest songs on the record. I like them but I'm hoping for a little more from the rest of the record.

As for the comparisons to "Are You Ready" and "Puttin Down", I can see where that can be noticed. HOWEVER, I may be different than a lot of other fans but I happen to like both of those songs. I think "Are You Ready" is a very good beginner for IVL which I enjoyed quite a bit.