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BUSH BURSTS HUBBLE BUBBLE
#1

I thought of the title myself. Sorry. :roll:

After all these years giving us such amazing views of space, Bush's God complex (first the Earth, tomorrow the universe)has put an end to Hubble. Read on. Be outraged. I know it's only a frickin' telescope, but we've been admiring its accomplishments for years and this is a huge morale buster for space buffs such as myself. And all for the PURPOSELESS, INANE, MISGUIDED, and just plain ABSURD goal of putting men on the moon - again.


Hubble casualty of Bush space plan

Friday, January 16, 2004 Posted: 7:54 PM EST (0054 GMT)

WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Hubble Space Telescope will be allowed to degrade and eventually become useless, as NASA changes focus to President Bush's plans to send humans to the moon, Mars and beyond, officials said Friday.

NASA canceled all space shuttle servicing missions to the Hubble, which has revolutionized the study of astronomy with its striking images of the universe.

John Grunsfeld, NASA's chief scientist, said NASA administrator Sean O'Keefe made the decision to cancel the fifth space shuttle service mission to the Hubble when it became clear there was not enough time to conduct it before the shuttle is retired. The servicing mission was considered essential to enable the orbiting telescope to continue to operate.

"This is a sad day," said Grunsfeld, but he said the decision "is the best thing for the space community."

He said the decision was influenced by President Bush's new space initiative, which calls for NASA to start developing the spacecraft and equipment for voyages to the moon and later to Mars. The president's plan also called for the space shuttle to be retired by 2010. Virtually all of the shuttle's remaining flights would be used to complete construction of the International Space Station.

The shuttle has been grounded since the explosion of the Columbia nearly a year ago.

Grunsfeld said Bush "directed us to use this precious resource" (the shuttle) toward completing the International Space Station and fulfilling U.S. obligations to the 15 partner nations.

Without servicing missions, he said, the Hubble should continue operating until 2007 or 2008, "as long as we can." NASA was already planning to replace the Hubble with a new, improved version, called the James Webb Space Telescope, scheduled for launch in 2011.

The Hubble has revolutionized astronomy. Using images from the craft, scientists have determined the age of the universe, about 13.7 billion years, and discovered that a mysterious energy, called the dark force, is causing all of the objects in the universe to move apart at an accelerating rate. This force is still poorly understood.

The observatory has ailing gyroscopes which were to be replaced on the servicing mission, which already has been delayed by the Columbia accident. Grunsfeld said the Hubble has three good gyros and one that is not working well. Software was being developed to work with only two gyroscopes, he said, but the telescope will not have the same capabilities.

Grunsfeld said the Hubble control team will attempt to extend the life of the telescope, but the gyros will degrade. He also said that while the batteries on the craft are constantly recharged, they eventually "will run out of juice."

The Hubble will eventually fall out of orbit and crash to Earth, probably in 2011 or 2012. To make that event safe, Grunsfeld said, NASA will design and build a small robot craft that will be launched and guided to the Hubble.

The robot craft would "grab the Hubble and bring it into the atmosphere in a controlled manner," he said, guiding the school-bus-sized craft to harmlessly splash into a remote part of an ocean.

One reason for the cancellation of repairs, Grunsfeld said, was the requirement that a backup space shuttle would have to be primed for launch when a space shuttle was sent to service the Hubble, a requirement set after the Columbia accident. NASA officials decided then that a backup would have to be ready to help any shuttle going anywhere but the International Space Station.

Servicing missions are required to the Hubble every few years to tune up the complex craft and to replace worn-out parts. Four times previously, spacewalking astronauts have installed new parts or upgraded the observatory with new instruments.

The Hubble, the first of NASA's orbiting observatories, was launched in 1990 with the promise that it would see farther out in space than any previous telescope. But scientists quickly learned that its main mirror was, in effect, nearsighted due to a flaw in manufacturing of the basic mirror. Astronauts in 1993 installed optics that sharpened the vision. Later servicing missions replaced broken parts and added improved cameras and other instruments.

Images from the Hubble glimpsed galaxies back to a point just a few hundred million years after the Big Bang, thought to be the explosive beginning of the universe. Astronomers have found that galaxies and clusters of galaxies formed much earlier that theorists had expected. This suggests that planets where life was possible could have formed as early as about 12 billion years ago. The solar system, which includes the sun and Earth, is much younger, about 5 billion years old.
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#2

Instead Bush wants to spend 1,000 billion dollars trying to get people on Mars, when the debt of the US is already unbelievably high. :roll:
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#3

Bush has his own priorities....
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#4

You think that's bad. Check this out!!!

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.cbc.ca/fifth/conspiracytheories/saudi.html">http://www.cbc.ca/fifth/conspiracytheories/saudi.html</a><!-- m -->

Coincidence? I don't think so. Confusedhock:
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#5

That's some freaky sh*t, angie...I think I remember seeing that 5th Estate ages ago, but to have the facts laid out in black and white is pretty amazing.
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#6

I don't believe everything I read, but I know that something bigger then you or I can ever imagined is going on right now.

I need 2 Kingston Tickets, please help.
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#7

mrlayance Wrote:I don't believe everything I read, but I know that something bigger then you or I can ever imagine is going on right now.

Dam Straight........

I will not give up. My face is set,my gait is fast,my goal is heaven,my road is narrow,my way is rough,my companions are few,my guide is reliable,my mission is clear. I cannot be bought,compromised,detoured,lured away,turned back,diluted or delayed. I will not flinch in the face of sacrifice,hesitate in the presence of adversity,negotiate at the table of the enemy,ponder at the pool of popularity,or meander in the maze of mediocrity. I will not give up,shut up or slow down....Blessed Be!
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#8

I'm going to be in the minority here, but I think going to Mars and possibly colonizing the moon is a good thing. Every single time in humanity's history we have started looking inward, we have suffered from shortsightedness and ignoring problems brewing on the horizon. I've always been a sci-fi geek and any opportunity to go to the stars ive been in favor of because thats part of humanity's ethos, to explore and search out new places. We'd wither as a human race if we just became concerned with everyday concerns, as problematic as they can be.Secondly, I think it should be pointed out that all the complaining about spending money on space programs and not as much on social welfare issues is missing one thing, the fact that we have been spending a lot of social issues like homelessness, poverty and unemployment and the problem is still with us. I don't think that throwing more money at the problem is the answer, especially on the federal level. the best ways to solve these problems is a mixture of social, religious and state government intervention. anyway, thats not really the issue here. Humans are explorers, its part of our makeup to go out and discover new places and worlds. We dont always do a good job of being good neighbors to these new places we discover, but we arent perfect. Just my two nickels of thought Big Grin
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#9

It bugs me that with the money bush spends on finding new ways of blowing ourselves up, he could put a serious dent in, say, third world debt.
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#10

VioletlightHeron Wrote:I don't think that throwing more money at the problem is the answer, especially on the federal level. the best ways to solve these problems is a mixture of social, religious and state government intervention.

True but what about something like healthcare? Money would certainly be useful there, the government could help relieve costs for those less fortunate. I saw this documentary on tv the other day, about a couple in the US. The guy was unemployed so he didn't have healthcare and the woman was suffering from cancer. She had to keep working while she was getting chemotherapy in order to ensure she had healthcare coverage. That's just not right, is it? I don't know, maybe I've just been spoiled by our Dutch system.

I agree that humans are explorers and that includes going up into space but it's not priority number one. Plus I can't get over the fact that Bush is presenting this great plan a couple of months before he hopes to get re-elected.. just another self-promotion scam.
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#11

Kim Wrote:True but what about something like healthcare? Money would certainly be useful there, the government could help relieve costs for those less fortunate. I saw this documentary on tv the other day, about a couple in the US. The guy was unemployed so he didn't have healthcare and the woman was suffering from cancer. She had to keep working while she was getting chemotherapy in order to ensure she had healthcare coverage. That's just not right, is it? I don't know, maybe I've just been spoiled by our Dutch system.

I agree that humans are explorers and that includes going up into space but it's not priority number one. Plus I can't get over the fact that Bush is presenting this great plan a couple of months before he hopes to get re-elected.. just another self-promotion scam.


There are alot of valid points in your arguement about different health systems, however I don't know anything about Dutch health care, perhaps you could fill me in. The thing is here in the States, there are alot of big companies being squeezed by their health care costs and lots of disagreements between companies and unions when it comes to contract negotiation time. My granddad's pension from Bethelhem Steel got dumped when the company was acquired after spending years in bankruptcy. It sucked for the pensioners, but it isnt the fault of the new management because the previous management grew complacent and squeezed by foreign and domestic competition. Plus when the old management finally woke up and realized that they had to cut costs in order to survive, the pensioners and the union didnt want to budge on what had been promised to them. They were stuck and the company was stuck between a rock and a hard place. And if you remember correctly, Kennedy made his man on the moon by the end of the decade speech out of idealism and political concerns as well. Politicians are politicians, doesnt matter what party they belong to. There always has to be something in a policy issue that either addresses their political needs or makes them look good.
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#12

VioletlightHeron Wrote:I'm going to be in the minority here, but I think going to Mars and possibly colonizing the moon is a good thing. Every single time in humanity's history we have started looking inward, we have suffered from shortsightedness and ignoring problems brewing on the horizon. I've always been a sci-fi geek and any opportunity to go to the stars ive been in favor of because thats part of humanity's ethos, to explore and search out new places. We'd wither as a human race if we just became concerned with everyday concerns, as problematic as they can be.Secondly, I think it should be pointed out that all the complaining about spending money on space programs and not as much on social welfare issues is missing one thing, the fact that we have been spending a lot of social issues like homelessness, poverty and unemployment and the problem is still with us. I don't think that throwing more money at the problem is the answer, especially on the federal level. the best ways to solve these problems is a mixture of social, religious and state government intervention. anyway, thats not really the issue here. Humans are explorers, its part of our makeup to go out and discover new places and worlds. We dont always do a good job of being good neighbors to these new places we discover, but we arent perfect. Just my two nickels of thought Big Grin

*shudder* The simple phrase "possibly colonising the moon" is frightening. It serves as a reminder of the white, patriarchical essence of conquering and destroying. Colonialism is partly the reason for the tribal and racial disasters in Africa and other places in the world that white Europeans thought they had a right to embark upon, steal people, pillage, rape and destroy lands that they had no business (nor right) to invade upon. So perhaps, if there are life forms on other planets, I hope that humans do not get a hold of them, because the ethnocentricities and essentialisms will begin once again. It disgusts me to think about it.

How can a society (or societies) suffer from so-called "short-sightedness" when humanity cannot see the very problems in front of it? Do you think that we should stop the self-reflexivity that has now arrived in this post-modern age so that we can forget all of what is wrong with us in search of bigger and better things? This is the first time in history that we are looking at our current time period with thought, and not searching for some sort of transcendence or ideal... this is the time that we must carefully use to better our societies by looking for the causes while beginning to implement change. You can only sweep the dirt under the carpet for so long until it pervades. For centuries, humanity has refused to look inward for solutions or even a diagnosis... therefore, by blinding ourselves with the likes of capitalistic, scientific and imperialistic ventures, we will surely lead to future distasters (in the horizon)

The human race will wither away for lack of caring for itself. Its like personal hygeine... its a necessity. And i disagree, i think that the human race is not necessarily a bunch of "explorers"... there is always some (selfish) and underlying mission for new things... whether it be for exploitation, greed or power.

Leslee
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#13

The entire humans-in-space program is a waste of money. Back in the Sixties and Seventies the American had to keep ahead of the Soviet was machine, so they used that to justify keeping the space program alive. Later, they started telling the world that innumerable benefits for us here on earth would come out of research done in space. They talked about new health-and-longevity-benefiting stuff that would come about. They talked about using it to improve our quality of life. However, after 40 years of the space program, NOTHING has come out of it that we could use to our advantage. Yes, some technology was developed for the space program that we otherwise wouldn't have (smaller computers, etc) but those are mere BY-PRODUCTS of a program that has wasted trillions of dollars over a number of decades.

When that rocket blew up over Texas last year, those men and women died in vain. Do you know what they were doing in their last days? They had 50 assignments to carry out on their mission, over 40 of which were suggestions by ELEMENTARY SCHOOL KIDS that were just designed to capture more interest in the space program and keep the young of American believing it has some purpose. What a shameful waste! The US spent billions of that mission, as they always do, so some fourth-grader in Tupelo can know what happens to sunflower seeds in zero gravity. And it cost those astronauts their lives. Purposeless, purposeless, purposeless.

And then there's always AH's point about how if we do manage to colonize another planet or the Moon, we'll just f*ck it up as we always have done. Think about it - those lunatics down at NASA are saying this is a pursuit which could unite all mankind in our wondrance and fascination and drive to know what's out there and what we can do. Uh, didn't we already colonize another world? Ever hear of THE NEW WORLD? We discovered half a planet never seen before and instead of saying "we must unite to explore it and profit from it for all our benefit", we said "get the f*ck out, this new world's ours!" and we fought for 200 years over it. And if you think we've "Evolved" since then, you've got another thing coming.

Prediction for the future: if we succeed in putting a colony on the moon, American Republicans will try and put nuclear weapons there as a defense strategy.

The ONLY thing about the space program I support is communication and exploratory satellites like Hubble. Humans do not belong in space. It's not worth it.
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#14

AmbitionlessHipster Wrote:*shudder* The simple phrase "possibly colonising the moon" is frightening. It serves as a reminder of the white, patriarchical essence of conquering and destroying. Colonialism is partly the reason for the tribal and racial disasters in Africa and other places in the world that white Europeans thought they had a right to embark upon, steal people, pillage, rape and destroy lands that they had no business (nor right) to invade upon. So perhaps, if there are life forms on other planets, I hope that humans do not get a hold of them, because the ethnocentricities and essentialisms will begin once again. It disgusts me to think about it.

How can a society (or societies) suffer from so-called "short-sightedness" when humanity cannot see the very problems in front of it? Do you think that we should stop the self-reflexivity that has now arrived in this post-modern age so that we can forget all of what is wrong with us in search of bigger and better things? This is the first time in history that we are looking at our current time period with thought, and not searching for some sort of transcendence or ideal... this is the time that we must carefully use to better our societies by looking for the causes while beginning to implement change. You can only sweep the dirt under the carpet for so long until it pervades. For centuries, humanity has refused to look inward for solutions or even a diagnosis... therefore, by blinding ourselves with the likes of capitalistic, scientific and imperialistic ventures, we will surely lead to future distasters (in the horizon)

The human race will wither away for lack of caring for itself. Its like personal hygeine... its a necessity. And i disagree, i think that the human race is not necessarily a bunch of "explorers"... there is always some (selfish) and underlying mission for new things... whether it be for exploitation, greed or power.

Leslee

ahh debate! Yippee! :jump

Ok, while you have a very valid point about what white colonial explorers did in Africa and Asia in the 1500's-1800's, you forget about the other non-white "exploiters" did to peoples of their own race or other races; The Mongols invading Russia and China in the 1200's-1400's, the Japanese invading China in the 20th century, the Vikings invading europe in the 9th and 10th century. All of these examples show that no matter what race, creed, color you are, there are individuals who will exploit others for their own profit..its not just whites. Secondly, while it would be great to have everybody treat each other fairly and equitably as good neighbors all the time, its not logical to expect people with different competing interests to play fair..its the nature of humans, of animals even to not play fair. Who's heard of a wolf that walks up to a sheep and asks politely for a lamb shank? Unlike animals, Humanity has evolved over the centuries as certain behaviors have been deemed unacceptable. We've gotten over, for the most part i feel, discriminating against others because of their skin colour, religion, what have you. It's not a perfect society, discrimination and hatred does happen, but i think to make a society that ensures equality of all citizens, you'd have to have a very powerful government that makes most of the decisions. Frankly, that scares me because ANY type of government that wishes to have a "fair", well ordered people eventually starts loving power for its own sake and loses sight of its goals. Communism had a great goal, everybody gets the same treatment, land, wealth, the government insures equal distribution of power to its citizens. Then it started treating some of its citizens as less than equal because those citizens disagreed with their goals, then it became paranoid and didnt trust its own citizens. Capitalism and Communism have their own share of flaws and weaknesses, but i trust capitalism and democracy more because everyone has the right to vote and speak their mind. They can be manipulated by Repubs, Dems, corporations, labor unions, etc but they have that vote to say what they want. I say it is better to acknowledge our failings and mistakes but not dwell on them all the time. Hindsight is 20/20 perfect vision. I appreciate where you are coming from, but i disagree with your viewpoint :thumb:
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#15

We replied at the same time! I'm glad you picked up on the "its not logical to expect people with different competing interests to play fair" issue as well. That's the one thing I've always believed - the idea of unity and equality because of what space can do for us is a joke.
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