[The Darkest Canuck]

1. Why do you think kids dream of playing in the NHL?? For love of the game? No, because they want to be rich. It's a fact.

2. The players have every right to not accept a deal. Only problem is, 75 percent of the hockey watching public are against the players.

3. So how do you know how much a player is worth to fans???? Personally, I'm not even affected by the lockout because I don't miss watching hockey. It's not that big of a deal. Speak for yourself about the "players' worth". Iginla is a great player but he's worth nothing to me. Without him, my life isn't any worse off. I agree the top players should make decent salaries but who exactly can determine what they are worth? The only logical way for me would be to connect that to revenues. How can you say a player is worth X amount of dollars if it isn't in correlation to the revenues? So if a team makes 30 million, does it make sense that one player should get 10 million? Maybe it does because I don't understand the mindset of some fans who would spend their whole paycheck watching a bunch of goons skate up and down the ice. I try to spend my money on more important things, and try to stay away from "idol worship".

4. The least you can say is that CFL players play for the love of the game because they make peanuts for money. I think the point was that salaries are directly proportional to revenues which only makes sense. NHL players know it makes sense too but they are letting their greed and egos get in the way of doing something reasonable about the issue. They think they can fool the fans. Sorry, but the average person is smart enough to see what the players are doing and that's why hardly anyone is backing the players in the court of public opinion.

1. no, that it is not a fact, that is YOUR OPINION, believe it or not there's a big difference between opinion and fact. besides, everybody knows the dream is to hoist the Stanley Cup, that's the real reason anyone plays in the NHL.

2. too bad the public has no say in what transpires eh? good thing too, because if we learned anything from last November's elections in the USA, the general public is dumb, and believes whatever the media tells them to believe.

3. It doesn't matter what a player is worth to you, what matters is how much a player is worth to his franchise.

4. it doesn't make sense for them, because they can get a better deal than that, because there is more money to be made off of the NHL than the CFL. the CFL is like the AHL of pro football, not the NHL.

[chris]

My first (and hopefully last) instance of a stone wanting to escape occurred on a flight from Ottawa to Toronto. The pain was unbearable, and all I was passing was blood. They emergency/priority landed the plane in Toronto, took me off in a stretcher into the ambulance, and straight into surgery (actually surgery wasn't until the next morning... but in the interim they juiced me up with morphine and other painkillers/anti-inflammatory drugs)

It's been 2.5 years since that day, and until I went to see a nutritionist last November, I had constant kidney pain. Since then, nada. (Ultrasounds still show one 7mm stone in my left kidney.)

[Lizard King]

My first (and hopefully last) instance of a stone wanting to escape occurred on a flight from Ottawa to Toronto. The pain was unbearable, and all I was passing was blood. They emergency/priority landed the plane in Toronto, took me off in a stretcher into the ambulance, and straight into surgery (actually surgery wasn't until the next morning... but in the interim they juiced me up with morphine and other painkillers/anti-inflammatory drugs)

It's been 2.5 years since that day, and until I went to see a nutritionist last November, I had constant kidney pain. Since then, nada. (Ultrasounds still show one 7mm stone in my left kidney.)

All this kidney stone talk has got me paranoid... is there anything I can do to help ward of this problem, you know some preventitive maintenance perhaps, is it mostly related to diet? (sorry to go off topic, but im curious)

[The Horrible Esthete]

It's been 2.5 years since that day, and until I went to see a nutritionist last November, I had constant kidney pain. Since then, nada. (Ultrasounds still show one 7mm stone in my left kidney.)

Wow, chris....sounds like you've had it rougher than most! I've never had surgery....but lots of blood and pain. Definitely the most severe I've ever experienced - mostly because it is so constant - it never seems to fluctuate...it just steadily worsens for hours and hours. Uuugghh.

LizardKing - Best advice is to drink lots of water!!

I've also had doctors tell me that for further preventive measure, drink gatorade or cranberry juice.

:thumb:

[o78]

But what exactly causes kidney stones and why are so many of you getting them??

[chris]

But what exactly causes kidney stones and why are so many of you getting them??

There are all kinds of kidneys stones, and a lot of people have them. Approximately 1 in 4 people will have kidney stones, but only 1 in 10 will know it and suffer from it.

They are caused by a wide variety of dietary factors (and change depending on an individuals chemical composition).

The simplest thing a person can do to avoid kidney stones is to drink lots of water. Your urine should be just about clear at all times - unless you are taking heavy supplements, or strong multi-vitamins. If it's not, you are not drinking enough water.

Think about when you go out drinking alcohol with friends. Your urine becomes clear because all of the participates that are in your urine are so well disolved that you can't see them. When you get dehydrated, your urine gets darker because it is more concentrated. If it becomes too concentrated, small crystals form. If these form in your kidney (where urine is produced) they can cause sever damge and pain. Next stop, where significant pain results, is your ureter - the tube from kidney to bladder. They can also lodge in your bladder, and then the final stage is the urethra as they exit your body.

Imagine trying to force a .5" spiked, razor sharp crystal through a .125" tube! That's what happens when you get a bad stone. And it tears all the way out.

My ureter was so badly damaged that they had to implant a ureteric stent for 3 weeks in order to allow my body to continue to function while it healed.

Upon further thought, my stones occurred during October 2002, not November. During the 3 weeks that I had the stent implanted, I went to The Hip's shows at The Hummingbird Centre. My seats were right in front of the speakers and the stent vibrated at a different rate than the rest of my body. It was a very, very strange sensation.

[VioletlightHeron]

2. too bad the public has no say in what transpires eh? good thing too, because if we learned anything from last November's elections in the USA, the general public is dumb, and believes whatever the media tells them to believe.

If you believe this, then you are truly dumber than I was lead to believe. The mainstream media was generally skeptical of ANYTHING George Bush said during the campaign and went to great lengths to debunk and point out some of the inaccuracies of the Swift Boat allegations.

[Lizard King]

LizardKing - Best advice is to drink lots of water!!


:thumb:

Thats good because I drink TONS of it, I easily get the recommended 8 glasses a day sometimes more. Hopefully Ill be able to avoid this nasty problem.

[tigerthelion]

1. Why do you think kids dream of playing in the NHL?? For love of the game? No, because they want to be rich. It's a fact.

2. The players have every right to not accept a deal. Only problem is, 75 percent of the hockey watching public are against the players.

3. So how do you know how much a player is worth to fans???? Personally, I'm not even affected by the lockout because I don't miss watching hockey. It's not that big of a deal. Speak for yourself about the "players' worth". Iginla is a great player but he's worth nothing to me. Without him, my life isn't any worse off. I agree the top players should make decent salaries but who exactly can determine what they are worth? The only logical way for me would be to connect that to revenues. How can you say a player is worth X amount of dollars if it isn't in correlation to the revenues? So if a team makes 30 million, does it make sense that one player should get 10 million? Maybe it does because I don't understand the mindset of some fans who would spend their whole paycheck watching a bunch of goons skate up and down the ice. I try to spend my money on more important things, and try to stay away from "idol worship".

4. The least you can say is that CFL players play for the love of the game because they make peanuts for money. I think the point was that salaries are directly proportional to revenues which only makes sense. NHL players know it makes sense too but they are letting their greed and egos get in the way of doing something reasonable about the issue. They think they can fool the fans. Sorry, but the average person is smart enough to see what the players are doing and that's why hardly anyone is backing the players in the court of public opinion.

1. no, that it is not a fact, that is YOUR OPINION, believe it or not there's a big difference between opinion and fact. besides, everybody knows the dream is to hoist the Stanley Cup, that's the real reason anyone plays in the NHL.

2. too bad the public has no say in what transpires eh? good thing too, because if we learned anything from last November's elections in the USA, the general public is dumb, and believes whatever the media tells them to believe.

3. It doesn't matter what a player is worth to you, what matters is how much a player is worth to his franchise.

4. it doesn't make sense for them, because they can get a better deal than that, because there is more money to be made off of the NHL than the CFL. the CFL is like the AHL of pro football, not the NHL.

1. Sorry, but it is YOUR OPINION and opinion only that players play for the love of the game. Your opinon is no more valid than mine. You believe what the players tell you. I judge for myself, based on their actions. Just a difference of opinion, that's all, but to say you know for a fact that the only reason players are in hockey is to get the Cup is ridiculous. It all depends on what you believe. I happen to more cynical of the players and don't believe what they tell the media.

2. Well, if the public doesn't buy tickets to games in the future, there will be less money for the players so it does matter a bit I think. Less fans, less sponsorships, tv deals, etc.

4. Maybe the players can get a better deal but a lot of them can't afford to sit out two years because they don't have too many years of playing left. You think the players who only have a few years left of playing are happy to play in Russia or Switzerland or Detroit (Chelios for ex) for way less than they could be making before retiring from the NHL? I hope the players realize the owners aren't giving in.

[jen]

Excellent job in the description with kidney stones there, Chris :thumb:

I had the stent in also for one of my larger stones, the other ones passed on their own with lots of pain. I had 7 on one side and 8 on the other at one point. Other times it has just been one here and there. For all I know, there could be more built up inside right now, but luckily I haven't felt them.

Best advice to all: Drink lots and lots water to keep your kidneys flushed and the cystals from forming. (Although, sometimes genetics and dietary problems are causes that you can't avoid)


Like I said, Kidney stones Suck!



HUGE :rambo:

[NMAS]

1. if you think it is being played for the love of the game you are fooling yourself.

2. Owners have the right to make a profit

3. Everyone knows the players are not going to starve if the large salaries are cut back a bit. so the average salary goes from 1.7 to 1.3 so what, 99% of us would be happy with that.

4. Look at the CFL that is the league the NHL should be comparing itself to

1. NHL games are played because there is money to be made, that's been the sole purpose of the league since the "original 6" era, but on the other side of it, none of the players in the NHL started (and kept on) playing hockey because they wanted to make a lot of money, they play because it's their passion...just because it also happens to be their job doesn't mean they shouldn't try to make as much $ as possible, that's what you're supposed to do in a capitalist society right? everybody wants to be paid as much as possible for the job they do, you're a liar if you say otherwise.

2. the players have the right to not accept a deal they don't like and hold out for a better one.

3. of course 99.% of us would be happy with that, because we aren't worth that much, it's different when you ARE worth that much and people won't acknowledge or accept it, then i imagine it'd be frustrating.

4. if you have that low of an opinion of the NHL, that you'd compare it to the CFL, i'd suggest that you probably aren't a true fan of the league, or the game of hockey itself, and i probably won't bother allowing myself to be concerned with your opinion on the matter from here on in.

Theyare trying to make more than what is possible!!!!! that is the whole problem with this thing, don't you get it. YOu are not worth the time guy.
I respect that you hava an opinion, but it makes no sense.

They are not worth that much sorry, sure they deserve to make a great living but what they have is way to high, they have to realize that.

I do have a low opinion of the NHLPA not the NHL, and I am COparing the NHL to the CFL because the CFL players and owners realize there situation and are working together to build the game again and it is working, thos eplayers will make more money as the league grows. The NHL has to start over as well.

[direwolf74]

Theyare trying to make more than what is possible!!!!! that is the whole problem with this thing, don't you get it. YOu are not worth the time guy.
I respect that you hava an opinion, but it makes no sense.

They are not worth that much sorry, sure they deserve to make a great living but what they have is way to high, they have to realize that.

I do have a low opinion of the NHLPA not the NHL, and I am COparing the NHL to the CFL because the CFL players and owners realize there situation and are working together to build the game again and it is working, thos eplayers will make more money as the league grows. The NHL has to start over as well.

My friend, you just hit the nail right on the head. I couldn't agree more. This thing isn't going to be fixed until the NHLPA gets their heads out of their asses and begins to realize the economics of the situation. This is the greatest hockey league in the world, and these players need to understand that playing in the NHL is a privilege, not a right. I love Jarome Iginla as a player, and I love what he did for Flames last season, but I don't understand how he can whine about having to possibly cut his salary down from 7 million to 5 million. Ooh, poor Jarome. How is he gonna feed his family with that? These guys seem to forget that they're being paid a lot of money to play a GAME.

It's incredibly sad to think that the last time the Stanley Cup wasn't awarded was during the spanish flu epidemic in 1918. This time it's because of greed. How sad is that? I'm angry at both sides for letting things get this bad, but at least the owners are taking some of the responsibility and have proposed a realistic plan on how to fix it. Besides the players' 24% rollback offer back in December (which wouldn't have worked by the way), what the hell else have they done? Absolutely nothing. They refuse to look at any of the books, even though many owners have offered to show them their numbers. I think these players need to take some advice from the older guys who played in the league before them. Many of these guys have all gone on to become businessmen, and they understand basic economics and how a business works. I heard a great interview with Jim Peplinski the other day. He was asked what his response would be if he was still playing today and the owners offered a deal that would guarantee the survival of the league with a $1.3 million salary cap. His response: "Where do I sign up!" He also talked a bit about how the majority of these guys are already making more money than they'll ever need in their lives, and he can't understand why they wouldn't be happy with that.

And here's a great quote from Guy Lafleur:

"I have no respect for the mentality of some of the players. They say I'm frustrated I didn't make their type of money. Well, I don't give a (expletive). We played with passion, for the love of the game. If today's players are so smart, why don't they buy a (expletive) franchise and they'll see what's going on."

[chris]

Give me $5,000,000 once. That's all I'd need to live the rest of my days in luxury.

I figure that I have about 50 years or so left on the planet. That works out to $100,000 per year until I'm broke, assuming I just keep the money in my basement and don't invest it wisely.

Most people won't make $5,000,000 cumulatively in their lifetime - so I have absolutely no sympathy for the players.

I think the league needs to fold, and somehow reform with a new set of rules and guidelines, based around a salary cap and profit sharing model.

[NMAS]

Give me $5,000,000 once. That's all I'd need to live the rest of my days in luxury.

I figure that I have about 50 years or so left on the planet. That works out to $100,000 per year until I'm broke, assuming I just keep the money in my basement and don't invest it wisely.

Most people won't make $5,000,000 cumulatively in their lifetime - so I have absolutely no sympathy for the players.

I think the league needs to fold, and somehow reform with a new set of rules and guidelines, based around a salary cap and profit sharing model.

Give me 280,000 to pay off my mortgage and I would be the happiest guy in the world.

I agree about folding, start from scratch, they have hit rock bottom, start re building.

[Kim]

People who enjoy screwing around with their mobile phones in public and play every possible ringtone over and over again. :rambo: