[The Horrible Esthete]

Jesus Camp -

If we organized a softball tournament, would you be interested?


--- Hades Glee Club

[BulletRiddled]

I really don't understand how this kind of thinking can survive in today's world. Why anyone today would be willing to not only believe, but to kill over thier prefered version of a fairy tale is just beyond me. Once they start bringing kids into it... christ, that's scary. I agree with downie_24. Richard Dawkins made an amazing documentary on this very subject a few years ago: Part 1 - Part 2
It shows exactly how people get suckered in to these beliefs, and how easy it is for them to go from believing in something to killing for it. My father is on the board of directors for a new age hippie church, and I see the exact same thing happening there. It's really, really scary stuff.


Besides, everyone knows that Xenu is our true Lord and saviour.

[Summiteer]

Besides, everyone knows that Xenu is our true Lord and saviour.

:lol:

[NMAS]

Note to Self God's actual name is-- Skippy the Wonder Dog. How cool is that!

[AndGraceToo]

More Scary Bible Camp..

This is bad..
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2006/09/18...29703.html

[sean.bonner]

I just watched this entire film, and this is the kind of stuff that should be shown around Halloween. I've seen the news coverage and the trailers, but it doesn't even come close to emulating the actual film.
There are some scary lines... two that stand out to me (if you've seen the film) are from the girl while she is in the gazebo colouring with crayons, and the second from Ted Haggard (...yes... ironic) (and the Haggard line I'm talking about is the line he said about Evangelical influence on elections... and then his sick, demented smile and laugh into the camera afterwards).
I was going to post anything for fear of getting in over my head, but I just have to know if anybody else here has actually seen this movie.
I am still in too much shock to really talk about it, I'm hoping that some intelligent conversation / Becky Fischer bashing could come out of this.
Sorry for rambling.

[Jenna_Bird]

I just watched this entire film, and this is the kind of stuff that should be shown around Halloween. I've seen the news coverage and the trailers, but it doesn't even come close to emulating the actual film. There are some scary lines... two that stand out to me

For those of us who haven't seen the film, what are the lines in question. You have certainly piqued my interest.

[ignore if you don't care for personal sidebars]

When I was in high school I started dating someone who was an Evangelical Christian. He was close enough to normal (or so I thought, at 16) but many of the people in his church/school were waaaaaaaaaaay over the top, to the point that they were frightening. I remember his little sister screaming at me for kissing him -- something about robbing him of his purity. Needless to say, that relationship didn't last too long, and neither did my alreadly fleeting beliefs in God.

-Jenna

[cochise]

Note to Self God's actual name is-- Skippy the Wonder Dog. How cool is that!

And he's a Hip fan :thumb:


EDIT: Now that I think about it, this makes complete sense..........Skippy = Dylan = God

[sean.bonner]

For those of us who haven't seen the film, what are the lines in question. You have certainly piqued my interest.

There's more than two... but there was one from a little girl, no older than 9, who said that God doesn't go to every church and there is such thing as "dead churches," which is basically any church where people sit and stand, and are relatively quiet (so...pretty much any other church)".
And then... Ted Haggard talking about how if all Evangelicals is the states voted, they could determine every election.

A lot of other lines also made me uncomfortable.
There's an entire section where the Evangelicals depicted talk about how Global Warming doesn't exist, and how creationism is the only logical explaination as to why we're here.

Kids as young as age 5 sit in on talks about abortion... and then later it shows these kids bawling their eyes out because they have committed sins...and I could go on. Just see it for yourself.

Ugh.

[grimes]

I don't know if you guys are South Park fans, but one of their recent episodes is a pretty good commentary on this sort of thing. Butters (one of the kids, for those unfamiliar) is suspected of being gay by his father, so he sends him to a camp to "pray the gay away." It's hilarious, but I wouldn't recommended it for the easily offended.

It's episode 1102 - "Cartman Sucks"

you can download or stream it from <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.southparkx.net/episodes/1102-cartman-sucks">http://www.southparkx.net/episodes/1102-cartman-sucks</a><!-- m -->

[skippy the wonder dog]

I haven't seen it (although, being omniscient, I don't really have to), but what I find alarming is this: when writers tracked down some of the people who run the camp that was profiled, to get their response to the film, they said they thought it was a fair portrayal of their beliefs.

So you're dealing with people so kooky that they think kooky is normal.

Yikes.

[sean.bonner]

I don't know if you guys are South Park fans, but one of their recent episodes is a pretty good commentary on this sort of thing. Butters (one of the kids, for those unfamiliar) is suspected of being gay by his father, so he sends him to a camp to "pray the gay away." It's hilarious, but I wouldn't recommended it for the easily offended.

It's episode 1102 - "Cartman Sucks"

you can download or stream it from <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.southparkx.net/episodes/1102-cartman-sucks">http://www.southparkx.net/episodes/1102-cartman-sucks</a><!-- m -->

I'm a South Park fan as well, and I think it's more of a commentary of homophobic America, and to a smaller degree, homosexuality and the church.

I think its a coincidence that they both have camps in them... the camp in Jesus Camp is nothing like in the South Park episode. If you ask me, it doesn't come too close to being targeted at this type of camp. Also, in the movie, there is only one brief mention of homosexuality... and that comes from Ted Haggard :lol: .

[fingernailsonhull]

I saw the film a couple of months ago.

Please allow me to let you in on how close I am to all of this. I'm currently living in St. Louis, MO. Only a few hours from where a lot of this was filmed. More than that, I'm attending a theological seminary here. It is absolutely nothing like what you saw in the film...please do not make that inference.

Religion (Christianity in particular) is a very big deal around here, and its influence increases as you move into more rural areas. The urban/rural divide is very apparent.

What troubled me the most was the emotional manipulation of these children. More than that, I have no problem calling what was going on in that movie brain-washing. It was startling.

Here is where our conversation might get a little heated. I'm not sure. As to Ted Haggard's comments regarding Christians and politics - I have a real problem with the way churches and politics interact here in the States (particularly in the South and the Midwest). Christians ought to vote and vote with their consciences (though why this is always reduced to abortion and gay marriage as litmus tests for candidates is beyond me). I also have no problem with Christians running for and holding political office and likewise, voting with their consciences. I have a feeling some of you might take issue with that. I'd be happy to discuss it.

What troubles me is the extent to which churches and church groups invest financially in particular candidates, parties, etc. come election time. I reject the sacred-secular divide we have concocted in our society, but at the same time, it is obvious that this is not the place of the church. The GOP does not equal Christianity. As a matter of fact, the Republican Party, frankly, stands at odds with a number of very important biblical principles. Why people look beyond this and focus solely on abortion, again, is beyond me. This makes them prime targets for political manipulation which is what is happening, as some recent books have pointed out. [End Rant]

And to come to Skippy's point, yes, these people are so kooky that they think kooky is normal. This sort of thing is bizarre. When it comes down to it, I have nothing but sympathy for the young children who are being manipulated in this way.

[sean.bonner]

well said.

[Sam]

...I have no problem calling what was going on in that movie brain-washing. It was startling.

I'd go even further. I'd describe this sort of behaviour as abusive. These people are abusing these children. The only reason they get away with it is because they're using god's name. Switch out god's name with the devil's and Children's Aid would be swooping down on these camps and the parents who allow their kids to attend.

What troubles me is the extent to which churches and church groups invest financially in particular candidates, parties, etc. come election time.

I'm less troubled by churches funding politicians that they support than I am by the American government funding churches who support them. That's essentially what's happening with Bush's so-called "Faith Based Initiatives" program; taxpayer's dollars are being funneled to churches that will then rally their members to vote Republican.

If I was American, I'd be really concerned. As a Canadian, I'm sufficiently concerned to be watching Stephen Harper and working actively to ensure that he doesn't get re-elected. Could you imagine a Harper majority - speaking of feeling nauseated.

Jesus Camp -

If we organized a softball tournament, would you be interested?


--- Hades Glee Club

HE - My "Feminist-BabyKiller Coven" would love to get into a soft-ball round robin, if the Jesus Camp people respond to your invite. Maybe we can invite the "Gay, Jewish, Hollywood Cabal?"