[ron]

damn i glad i wasn't on this flight


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4OxGkmvPng



wind gust of 150 mph

[Detrious]

You smell that? That's fear...
Adrenaline is brown

[skippy the wonder dog]

A great pilot wouldn't have messed up the crosswind landing to begin with.

[Gangrel]

I can't view youtube here at work, but if that's the one from Germany, he IS a great pilot.

There was a storm going on, and on the first attempt at landing the plane was hit with a 215 kmh gust of wind on the side.

So ya, it is possible to "mess up" the landing if you're hit with near hurrican winds.....


edit:

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article3478681.ece">http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w ... 478681.ece</a><!-- m -->

155mph crosswind, whatever that is in kmh.....

[skippy the wonder dog]

155mph crosswind, whatever that is in kmh.....

A false report, that's what that is. Reports that winds were gusting to that speed were incorrect. Maximum gusts were in fact one third that speed. Search on the story and you'll find that has since been corrected.

A pilot attempting to land in cross winds gusting to hurricane force would be criminally irresponsible.

[Tthip]

I can't view youtube here at work

How To Do Stuff At Work

[skippy the wonder dog]

By the way, here's a great photo of the accident:
http://www.airliners.net/uf/view.file?id...OltUWB.jpg

[The Horrible Esthete]

I certainly have no way of knowing how difficult that approach was, considering the crosswind, for a typical commercial airline pilot.

I'm assuming skippy has smoothly landed an Airbus A320 in similar conditions a handful of times.....

Great pilot? I have way of knowing. Great recovery? I'd surely say so.

[skippy the wonder dog]

I'm assuming skippy has smoothly landed an Airbus A320 in similar conditions a handful of times.....

There's no comparing my only flying experience, which is fooling with a simulator, to actually landing an airliner. And obviously this landing was a lot more difficult than touching down a Cessna in a pleasant breeze. But that's beside the point -- I'm not saying I could land an A320 in a 30-knot crosswind, because I can't. I'm saying that the pilot here made mistakes that led to the accident. And I did find a professional airline pilot's forum where the consensus is the pilot erred.

Pilots are paid to make correct decisions and follow correct procedure, not to recover from mistakes they shouldn't have made.

I know we have an Air Canada pilot on the board ... maybe we'll hear from him.

[The Horrible Esthete]

I'm not saying I could land an A320 in a 30-knot crosswind, because I can't. I'm saying that the pilot here made mistakes that led to the accident....Pilots are paid to make correct decisions and follow correct procedure, not to recover from mistakes they shouldn't have made.

Fair enough.

So you're saying that pilots (not air traffic control or airport officials) on approach to the runway are a) responsible for knowing the strength of the crosswinds just above surface elevation, including maximum gust speed, and b) are responsible for communicating that information to the tower so ATC can coordinate runway clearance?

I would've assumed that it was the other way around.

[The Horrible Esthete]

I can't view youtube here at work

How To Do Stuff At Work

I had no idea:

When a Web page is Inaccessible: Just send an email addressed to <!-- e --><a href="mailto:www@web2mail.com">www@web2mail.com</a><!-- e --> with the URL of the web page in the Subject field (e.g. <!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.cnn.com">www.cnn.com</a><!-- w -->) and you’ll soon find a copy of that web page in your Inbox. A similar service is provided by <!-- e --><a href="mailto:www4mail@wm.ictp.trieste.it">www4mail@wm.ictp.trieste.it</a><!-- e --> - it will also fetch websites for you through email though in this case, the site address should go in the body of the email message.

Sweet.

Thanks Dana :thumb:

[skippy the wonder dog]

I'm not saying I could land an A320 in a 30-knot crosswind, because I can't. I'm saying that the pilot here made mistakes that led to the accident....Pilots are paid to make correct decisions and follow correct procedure, not to recover from mistakes they shouldn't have made.

Fair enough.

So you're saying that pilots (not air traffic control or airport officials) on approach to the runway are a) responsible for knowing the strength of the crosswinds just above surface elevation, including maximum gust speed, and b) are responsible for communicating that information to the tower so ATC can coordinate runway clearance?

The pilot has information on weather including wind speed, gust speed, and direction, and is responsible for making the decision as to whether he can safely land.

In this case the pilot attempted to land on runway 23, although given the wind direction, runway 33 was more suitable. After going around, the pilot landed on 33.

FYI, other flights that day aborted attempts to land on 23, and some chose to divert to Frankfurt. So clearly, there are two questionable decisions before we even get down to control of the aircraft.

Those decisions aside, there's the actual control of the plane during the landing attempt. My understanding is on the A320 you still cross the controls when you align with the runway. This pilot didn't -- that's pretty clear.

Nobody can say whether a perfect pilot would have avoided any problems here, because (despite the b.s. from the airline) nobody can say how powerful that specific gust was. But this wasn't a shining example of "great" airline flying.

It's like praising the truck driver for driving into the ditch when he can't stop for the accident ahead -- because he's following too close.

[The Horrible Esthete]

It's like praising the truck driver for driving into the ditch when he can't stop for the accident ahead -- because he's following too close.

More like praising the truck driver who might have been following too close, but was able to swerve and miss the accident before going into a jackknife, sliding sideways down the shoulder, and somehow steering out of it without incident mere feet before his sloshing load of NaOCl smashed into a NH3 tanker 100 feet from an elementary school during recess.