You know how some people complain about sucky set lists? - Printable Version
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- LIVELOVEtheHIP - 10-27-2004
re: The Horrible Esthete's comments...
You were speaking of "The Hip concert Newbie getting consideration" over veterans like yourself, a "half-fan" to "drop $30 on a Hip concert instead of a Nelly show the following week.....
Not sure if you were responding to my "thoughts", but if so, that's a little unfair. I just recently discovered this forum, but I am certainly not a "concert newbie". I saw the hip for the first time in '95, and quite honestly I didn't see it as any kind of "competition" anyways. If that IS the case however, well then you win... You have spent more money, and are a true fan. I don't know what I was thinking! I also didn't realize that being a "newbie" gave me any less right to voice my opinions, or made them any less valuable. I really don't understand why you might think my thoughts aren't worthy of "consideration over yours". It is all personal opinion, which is what I thought this forum was for. I now know that I can only consider the opinions of those who are real and "experienced" Hip fans.
As for the Nelly comment, well, that is just not really worth responding to actually. I was simply intending to share my personal thoughts in a non-judgemental kind of way.
My apologies.
- LIVELOVEtheHIP - 10-27-2004
re: comments posted by The Horrible Esthete...
You made reference to the "Hip concert Newbie" and "half fan"getting "consideration over veterans" like yourself.
I am not sure if that was in response to my "thoughts", but if so, I think it is a little unfair. While I just recently discovered this forum, I have been a Hip fan for years, and first saw them back in '95. I didn't realize that it was any sort of "competition" anyways. It it IS, then you most certainly win... You have spent more money, and you are a true fan. I don't know what I was thinking!
I also don't understand why my "Newbie" status gives me any less right to voice my opinions, or makes them any less valuable than anyone elses. I will now know only to read, trust and consider the personal thoughts and opinions of those deemed "experienced". As for your your issue with my posts getting "more consideration" than yours... It is all personal opinion, which I thought this forum was all about. I think all posts are "considered" equally. Whether they are agreed with should have nothing to do with the person's "status" on this forum.
As for the comment about being a "half-fan" who "dropped $30 on one Hip concert instead of seeing Nelly the following week", well, that isn't really worth responding to actually. I was simply trying to share my thoughts in an objective and non-threatening manner.
My apologies.
- LIVELOVEtheHIP - 10-27-2004
oops... sorry! I didn't know the first post went through,and I submitted another one... just ignore either or!
- scottitude - 10-27-2004
Don't get scared off, LIVELOVEtheHIP; everyone's comments are valid and justified. Some of us might get a little passionate about our opinion and feelings and some of us might enjoy "pushing buttons". Sometimes it may be difficult to discern the true intent when the dialogue gets a bit heated. I'm presently guilty of both.
Truth be told, in the past I've found almost all of Horrible Esthete's posts to be insightful and maybe even profound, in some cases. Maybe that's why what I perceived to be an extreme position torqued me a little; a smart guy with a high degree of observational skill trashing our beloved Hip. Wrong or right, that was my perception and I don't think I'm the only one who saw it that way. Wrong or right, and whether or not he intended it to be, that was the position he conveyed.
If ever there was a reasonably successful artist (or group of artists) that made music for the sake of music, it's The Hip. If big-business was of any real interest, they'd be lip-synching other peoples songs on SNL...and they'd be selling multi-platinum records. But it isn't, they don't, and they aren't.
I think "Good Life" is a great song, with a powerful message. I totally got the meaning of the thread; I totally got the beauty. Meandering threads will happen and that's okay, what I don't think is okay is making someone feel badly, whether intentional or not, about trying to share the fact that Gord heard her, understood her, and wanted to perhaps make sure that the next fan might take the same solace she did from one of his grossly under-rated works.
That'll never make them rich in a monetary sense, but in the sense that matters, Gord and the boys are among richest beings on this spinning ball of chaos.
- spottrax - 10-27-2004
A couple more comments on the set list issue.
I am amongst the oldest hipbase folk in here. I remember the days before there was this thing...the internet. I have seen hundreds of concerts and believe it or not when a band came to town we had now idea of what they had been playing or would be playing. Regardless if a band played the same exact set list every single night or not... the concert-goer wouldnt' have the resorces to find out what they might or might not play!
Nowdays, I still go to shows all the time and I check up on web sites to see current set list (like we all do in here). Many bands simply play the exact songs in the exact order every night. A couple examples of this..."The Church" from australia (under the milky way fame) tours about every other year. To my dissapointment their set list stays the same all tour. They have a dozen albums of great music but only play the same 14 songs each night.
A friend of mine who loves Van Halen (not my style but I'll use for example) gave me the link to that bands current set lists. All are the same! Except for maybe one song per night. Same songs, same order. Please....IF I was a fan of that band I would really be lighting up a forum with anger over spending way more for a VH ticket than any Hip ticket!!!
Finally, I know I'll catch flack for this in here but I seen BNL this summer and followed their set list all tour. They did a cool thing by both staying with the hits every show AND rotating nuggets and I mean DEEP cuts all tour....every show.....SO you get "One Week " and "If I had a million $$" as well as "Get in Line" or Stomach vs. Heart". I'd like to see the Hip do something like that!
Peace! and congrats red sox!!! :thumb:
- john cage - 10-28-2004
The Horrible Esthete Wrote:I just want to know the logic behind playing those select songs again and again and again and again,
Because they like playing these songs? Not out of the realm of possibility.
- intothenight - 10-28-2004
The only thing I complain about is NO FUCKING DVD!
When one finally comes out, it better be the most comprehensive DVD of all time.
- skippy the wonder dog - 10-28-2004
Well, looks like I ignited a small fire.... point is, the tone of entitlement coming across in some people's setlist complaints (not limited to one person) is unwarranted. And really, I don't see why anyone could expect the band should play ten-year-old outtakes like Blonde Solid.
I'd rather hear something new.
- philhip37 - 10-28-2004
This reply is for the guy from Cinci. I have seen Fight and Midnight and Bring it and some of the other songs you love. At any time an old song can come out or it can be taken away. They were supossed to play Looking For in Clifton Park but they changed it. It is all luck of they draw. I have seen courage countless times and they never have played it the same way twice. That is why they play Meridian and Grace and NOIS all the time because they come out a little diferent each time. Sit back and let the music speak to you. I let it speak to me.
- MountainHip - 10-28-2004
Has anyone ever gone to the same restaurant twice?
- Pudge7681 - 10-28-2004
I am completely dumbfounded by the sheer hatred that has started to spew from the mouths (or fingers in this case) of my fellow hip fans. I too may be a NEWBIE to this forum but I am far from a concert NEWBIE. I refuse to post my "resume" for HIP FAN OF THE YEAR. The reason I love the Hip isn't because of a single setlist, it is because of the fact that I never know what to expect from them.
Whether it be on a new album or in a concert the boys never do the same thing twice. I don't complain when I hear Courage or NOIS or Hundredth, I simply revel in their beauty. Many bands don't have the extensive catalog that the Hip do and still more play the same setlist each night.
If you would like to hear all of your favorites or maybe something that you wouldn't even think of hearing but would be delightfully surprised, I ask you to do the following: pick up a guitar, learn the songs, wait 15-20 years and then let some drunken screaming fan tell you which one to play. I'm sure that you could do it. I mean it's not that hard, right?
If, on the other hand, you are like myself and would like the hip to keep playing for many years to come, then applaud the band for bringing in more fans by playing the classics each night. After all, I already own the albums...the new fans don't. In all honesty it is a sound business strategy to attract NEW fans instead of catering to only the VETERANS.
On the off chance that any of the boys read this...GOOD JOB! :thumb:
- The Horrible Esthete - 10-28-2004
LIVELOVEtheHIP Wrote:re: comments posted by The Horrible Esthete...
You made reference to the "Hip concert Newbie" and "half fan"getting "consideration over veterans" like yourself.
I am not sure if that was in response to my "thoughts", but if so, I think it is a little unfair.
No, those comments quoted abover were not referring to you specifically, and of course, you opinion is both valid and welcomed.
Look, alot of you all seem take things too personally - if you’re admittedly a casual fan, so be it. If you aren't, then why take offense? I don’t think there’s any wrong with being a casual fan, of course - I just believe that any business endeavor - including touring musical acts - should cater to its regular, most loyal customers before placating casual fans. Disagree if you want, but don’t take it so personally, and don’t label straightforward honest opinions as ‘hatred’ just because they might be somewhat critical of a band you love. Remember - I love them, too...
- john cage - 10-28-2004
What's somewhat amusing (to me) is we had this exact same thread over on the Rush fan site 'Counterparts' during the recently completed 30 anniv. tour.
The difference is Rush didn't change the setlist once while The Hip does so every night, just not as radically as some people might prefer.
I leaned to the 'make some changes' side for Rush. For The Hip, I lean to the 'I'd like to hear more songs, but am satsified with the setlists' side.
- Stickboy - 10-28-2004
I don't know if all of this talk of "Hipfan of the year" in a sarcastic tone has anything to do with me, but as a previous post mentioned, I am in fact not bragging when I say I have seen all I want to see, and done all I want to do as far as the Tragically Hip go.
I know I am not and have no desire to be ranked among the "Great Hipfans of all Time". I was simply making a point.
I am in no way militant about changing the setlists, nor will it change the way I feel about the band. Their music will always be my favorite and their concerts will always be my "Must See" concerts. I agree with some people on this post and I disagree with some people as well. I think that the band makes a lot of their decisions with people like Hipbasers in mind, as well as the new fan in mind. The selling of recorded shows, the Evening with the Hip shows and the Hip Club cards were all brought about for people like us, not the new fan. I really feel that the band tries really hard to please us, except when it comes to setlists.
I feel in a lot of ways Gord Sinclair's hands are tied. Gord Downie is prone to forgetting lyrics of tunes he has not sung in a while. I remember seeing him screw up Titanic Terrarium in Vancouver at Pacific Coliseum to the point that the band scrapped the song and moved on to 700ft Ceiling. Ithink because of this, Sinclair is limited in what he can choose to play.
I guess what I would like to see is a commitment to their fans to open up the catalogue and play some golden oldies...not an entire set of them, just a handful per tour. Pearl Jam recently played 3 shows in Boston during which they played their entire catalgoue. On a smaller scale, Pearl Jam and The Hip have a lot of similarities in their fan base. Why couldn't the hip attempt to do the same? Even the Stones recently toured and played some song from their catalogue that they hadn't brought out in a long time.
The people in here that are saying the band is playing to new fans, well why wouldn't bands like Pearl Jam and the Stones do the same. The Hip have been around longer than Pearl Jam and have proportionately atleast as many committed long time fans, so why is it too much to ask for 2 or 3 oldies per tour. Even if it was simply one song from the EP (Killing Time), Up to Here (Another Midnight) and Road Apples (Fight) that they played at every show, fans like us would be happy.
I guess where I am headed with this post is to say that we all feel the same way about the band regardless of what happens with the setlists, BUT we feel differently about what we can and should expect from a band once we enter the realm of "Hardcore, Long time fan". Some bands keep these fans in mind when they make setlists and some don't. I always hope that the Hip will decide to keep us in mind, and until they do, I will always sit and stew about how great it would be if they did.
I understand how lucky I have been, and how some people don't have the opportunity to see as many shows as I have seen whether it is because of money, geographic location or some other valid reason. I will never take for granted what I have had the luxury of experiencing. That being said I will not apologize for hoping the band will start to change the experience for people who have seen them enough times to hope for something new.
Please don't feel like I am attacking anyone, crapping on their opinions, or dismissing any points of view. I am simply sharing my point of view.
Stickboy (Jesse)
- cferneyh - 10-28-2004
Stickboy Wrote:The Hip have been around longer than Pearl Jam and have proportionately atleast as many committed long time fans, so why is it too much to ask for 2 or 3 oldies per tour.
Sort of off-topic, but that comment reminded me of that bit in the Hip's Egos and Icons MuchMusic special where Downie and Langlois (I think that's who it was) were being interviewed back in the day by a DJ at a Seattle radio station and the interviewer says: "We've got a caller with a question - Stone - who will be at tonight's show and who's band, Pearl Jam, is looking for a drummer." Always loved that.