PunBB

I saw a bit of a different show in Calgary the other night. A lot seems left out in the Calgary review. I know I should post this in that section but figured its an interesting topic worthy of it's own discussion.

First off the show was great and the Hip played as good as ever. But for Gord to poke jabs at our current Canadian government multiple times, in the PMs backyard no less was something. The day before Mr. Harper, at a stampede rally said Calgary is the greatest city in the greatest country in the world(home town crowd right?). Gord not making mention of those remarks reminded the crowd "the greatest city in the greatest country that understands with the term greatest comes the greatest responsibility". Leaving the stage he recommended the crowd to understand the politics they vote for and not to be taken advantage of(something along those lines). He also asked for a big stampede welcome to GARY HOLDEN and his family "A brave man with a strong vision who was given a raw deal". I only lived in Calgary briefly, its wonderful, my understanding is Mr. Holden was the ceo of enmax and it didn't end well. The Calgary media apparently chewed him up pretty good. Its an interesting read, and as a hip fan I recommend reading the letter Mr. Holden wrote of his side of the events. Mr. Downie is mentioned in it(<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.scribd.com/doc/41164357/Letter">http://www.scribd.com/doc/41164357/Letter</a><!-- m -->).

On a very unfortunate note, Fiddlers Green was on the setlist. At the beginning of the song someone was throwing peanuts towards the stage, followed by a pink cowboy hat, which Gord picked up. The crowd started to cheer. Gord held it out as if to be asking for donations(peanuts maybe). Some jerk thought it would be a good idea to throw his white cigarette lighter. Which with some force hit Gord right in the lip. He dropped the hat continued the song walking back from the edge of the stage check his lip for blood. I'm sure as most of you reading this it was a cringe worthy moment, the last thing you want to see is a performer in their element take someones garbage to the face. And during Fiddlers Green of all songs… Like most of you I've seen the Hip countless times and I've never been more embarrassed to be part of the crowd in my life. Truly unfortunate. After the song Gord told the audience, even his he begs please don't throw your garbage at the stage for me and the boy, please just don't(again something along those lines). He handled it very well for such an ugly moment. Personally I love seeing the Hip in Calgary, its always awesome, the crowds are loud and respectful! This being a closed event full of cowboy hats, beer, and insiders, maybe true colours were on display.

One thing I really wanted to ask, how does this forum feel about The Hip weighing in politically? This is not the first time, I'm sure most of you know, Gord has spoken against our Prime Minister. Personally I like it, I think Gord is an important voice. Just curious on your thoughts.

I agree it’s a worthy topic an I'm glad you brought it up. The only challenge is this type of thread often spirals out of control, loses focus and ends up being a childish spitting match driven by people's political agenda (or lack thereof). I think if it's kept as discussion as it relates to the Hip it could turn out to be a great thread. Having said that I'll throw in my two pence. I wish the band, individually or as a group would do more of this. As jad35 mentions they are an important voice in Canada, and as we've recently seen in Calgary (and other occasions in the past mostly through GD and Baker) they generally tend to be left of centre on most social issues. I think their Great Moon Gathering project, Gord's work with Waterkeepers, Baker's support for the Liberals in 2011, the band's collaboration with Warchild are all testament to their political orientation. In my opinion there is a distinct shortage of political voices that can speak to Canadian social issues and influence opinion to the point of casting a vote; hence perhaps the apathy we see with every election turnout, particularly from the demographic that a band like the Hip can reach.

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jad35 Wrote:I saw a bit of a different show in Calgary the other night. A lot seems left out in the Calgary review. I know I should post this in that section but figured its an interesting topic worthy of it's own discussion.

First off the show was great and the Hip played as good as ever. But for Gord to poke jabs at our current Canadian government multiple times, in the PMs backyard no less was something. The day before Mr. Harper, at a stampede rally said Calgary is the greatest city in the greatest country in the world(home town crowd right?). Gord not making mention of those remarks reminded the crowd "the greatest city in the greatest country that understands with the term greatest comes the greatest responsibility". Leaving the stage he recommended the crowd to understand the politics they vote for and not to be taken advantage of(something along those lines). He also asked for a big stampede welcome to GARY HOLDEN and his family "A brave man with a strong vision who was given a raw deal". I only lived in Calgary briefly, its wonderful, my understanding is Mr. Holden was the ceo of enmax and it didn't end well. The Calgary media apparently chewed him up pretty good. Its an interesting read, and as a hip fan I recommend reading the letter Mr. Holden wrote of his side of the events. Mr. Downie is mentioned in it(<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.scribd.com/doc/41164357/Letter">http://www.scribd.com/doc/41164357/Letter</a><!-- m -->).

Interesting. I'm not very up to speed politically these days, and I was curious about the origins of Gord's extended rant at the beginning of Grace, Too. I knew it had something to do with Harper's comments earlier in the day, but I didn't know the full background. Thanks for your post!

I think most people are set in their ways about politics, so having an opinion and sharing it with a large crowd does'nt necessarily herald change.

But, I think overall its a good thing when anyone takes an intelligent interest in politics and current affairs, if only to inspire an interest in others, and to get people thinking.

Politics and music ends up like politics and religion. Never a happy outcome.
I thought the Calgary show was great. Probably because I was at the front on the rail from 3:30pm till the end.
As for Gord speaking his thoughts..I wouldn't have it any other way. People with the spotlight on them should speak their mind, anything that helps engage the public into maybe more of a conscious thought process, right?
Also thought for dumping 17,500 people..give or take into that outdoor venue..you're always going to have some people looking to rock the boat and stir shit. For the most part though the crowd was well behaved.
I was also busy not caring what they were doing and just enjoying the up close experience. =)

jad35 Wrote:... He also asked for a big stampede welcome to GARY HOLDEN and his family "A brave man with a strong vision who was given a raw deal". I only lived in Calgary briefly, its wonderful, my understanding is Mr. Holden was the ceo of enmax and it didn't end well. The Calgary media apparently chewed him up pretty good. Its an interesting read, and as a hip fan I recommend reading the letter Mr. Holden wrote of his side of the events. Mr. Downie is mentioned in it(<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.scribd.com/doc/41164357/Letter">http://www.scribd.com/doc/41164357/Letter</a><!-- m -->).

I thought this was a very insightful open letter from an influential captain of the Canadian energy industry. Not what I expected. Thanks for the link!

my dad gave me a few kernels of wisdom, #1 always break up with your girlfriend before her birthday and christmas, #2 never sell a car to a friend, and #3 never tell anyone who you vote for or pray to! may have not done so well on the first one, but swear by the third.

floridahip Wrote:my dad gave me a few kernels of wisdom, #1 always break up with your girlfriend before her birthday and christmas, #2 never sell a car to a friend, and #3 never tell anyone who you vote for or pray to! may have not done so well on the first one, but swear by the third.

Though I'm sure many people follow your dad's #3, I have to disagree with it - politics and religion are two things that I think ought to be talked about, if only to increase eachother's knowledge on what's out there. If we don't view all sides to things and agree to only what we've learned, how are we ever really able to create & understand our own opinions?
If after talking about politics and religion people still hold their original views, that's fine. But, atleast they'll have a better picture as to why they ascribe to what they choose to.


Fear no art and you fear no reflection :wink:

nomadic Wrote:

floridahip Wrote:my dad gave me a few kernels of wisdom, #1 always break up with your girlfriend before her birthday and christmas, #2 never sell a car to a friend, and #3 never tell anyone who you vote for or pray to! may have not done so well on the first one, but swear by the third.

Though I'm sure many people follow your dad's #3, I have to disagree with it - politics and religion are two things that I think ought to be talked about, if only to increase eachother's knowledge on what's out there. If we don't view all sides to things and agree to only what we've learned, how are we ever really able to create & understand our own opinions?
If after talking about politics and religion people still hold their original views, that's fine. But, atleast they'll have a better picture as to why they ascribe to what they choose to.


Fear no art and you fear no reflection :wink:

agreed.

jad35 Wrote:One thing I really wanted to ask, how does this forum feel about The Hip weighing in politically? This is not the first time, I'm sure most of you know, Gord has spoken against our Prime Minister. Personally I like it, I think Gord is an important voice. Just curious on your thoughts.

I like it too. Gord's a smart guy and anyone who speaks against Harper is great in my books.

MattPower Wrote:Gord's a smart guy and anyone who speaks against Harper is great in my books.

:thumb:

In my opinion, it's not too hard to suss out the fact that Gord is a leftist, just based on his songs. It's actually something that I really like about him. It's fairly easy to read Gus the Polar Bear as a metaphor for the "us versus them" mentality of the Bush administration. It may have been more subtle than some of the other protest music that was coming out at the time, but it was still a timely and trenchant critique of America's myopic conservatism. Having said that, you really don't have to be a lefty to enjoy The Hip's music.

Interesting news from Attawapiskat ...

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jad35 Wrote:One thing I really wanted to ask, how does this forum feel about The Hip weighing in politically?

My two cents:

I'm not big on it. Whether it should happen to be a stance with which I might personally agree or disagree, I think it should be kept offstage, at the very least. Yes, certain artists are figures whose voices can be heard by many at a time, and go a long way to affect changes, raise awareness, or draw attention. And while there is certainly nothing wrong with using that voice for a perceived 'good', in principle, I do not believe the place for it is the stage, delivered to an audience who has paid to see an artistic performance. That said, if the political message lies within the art being performed, or is an integral part of the artist's creation, or if it had been clearly communicated beforehand that the performance was arranged as a platform for support of a political issue, then those are exceptions.

I reiterate - this opinion is exclusive to any particular political persuasion. We often hear Gord, himself, say "music brings people together". I love it when he says that. It's so true - in the physical sense, but also in perhaps a metaphysical sense, a social sense, an emotional sense, even a spiritual sense. So when using music to "bring people together", why risk dividing that audience with politics? Ideally, the same unifying traits of music could serve to unify people in support of (or resistance to) political agenda, but let's face it -- this rarely happens in today's world, if ever. Politics, to a general audience, is divisive.

On a personal level, hearing an artist stump onstage is awkward and uncomfortable when I agree, and abrasive and off-putting when I don't. Art -- music especially -- is a sanctuary. It's what I seek to escape the stresses and the irritants and the obligations of everyday life. And that goes double for live performance. Last thing I want to hear at a rock show is a political statement, or a shill, or an attempt at persuasion. If I already agree, it's ineffectual. If I disagree, it's insulting - because i just handed you some of my hard-earned income.

Offstage, it's a different matter. If an artist feels strongly enough about a political agenda to put his hat into the ring and try to influence a change or rally support, that's his own business. But then again, I'm not sure it's the smart thing to do from a career standpoint. I'm certainly not going to buy your record and attend your show because you stand for political causes I happen to already support. My beliefs aren't going to be swayed because an artist whose work I appreciate feels a certain way. The only thing that might happen when an artist I respect and whose work I appreciate waxes political, is that could wind up irritating me, disappointing me, offending me, or cause me to lose respect, which might influence a lessening of interest or patronage on my behalf.

Why risk any of that? Let politicians politick.

The Horrible Esthete Wrote:

jad35 Wrote:One thing I really wanted to ask, how does this forum feel about The Hip weighing in politically?

My two cents:

I'm not big on it. Whether it should happen to be a stance with which I might personally agree or disagree, I think it should be kept offstage, at the very least. Yes, certain artists are figures whose voices can be heard by many at a time, and go a long way to affect changes, raise awareness, or draw attention. And while there is certainly nothing wrong with using that voice for a perceived 'good', in principle, I do not believe the place for it is the stage, delivered to an audience who has paid to see an artistic performance. That said, if the political message lies within the art being performed, or is an integral part of the artist's creation, or if it had been clearly communicated beforehand that the performance was arranged as a platform for support of a political issue, then those are exceptions.

I reiterate - this opinion is exclusive to any particular political persuasion. We often hear Gord, himself, say "music brings people together". I love it when he says that. It's so true - in the physical sense, but also in perhaps a metaphysical sense, a social sense, an emotional sense, even a spiritual sense. So when using music to "bring people together", why risk dividing that audience with politics? Ideally, the same unifying traits of music could serve to unify people in support of (or resistance to) political agenda, but let's face it -- this rarely happens in today's world, if ever. Politics, to a general audience, is divisive.

On a personal level, hearing an artist stump onstage is awkward and uncomfortable when I agree, and abrasive and off-putting when I don't. Art -- music especially -- is a sanctuary. It's what I seek to escape the stresses and the irritants and the obligations of everyday life. And that goes double for live performance. Last thing I want to hear at a rock show is a political statement, or a shill, or an attempt at persuasion. If I already agree, it's ineffectual. If I disagree, it's insulting - because i just handed you some of my hard-earned income.

Offstage, it's a different matter. If an artist feels strongly enough about a political agenda to put his hat into the ring and try to influence a change or rally support, that's his own business. But then again, I'm not sure it's the smart thing to do from a career standpoint. I'm certainly not going to buy your record and attend your show because you stand for political causes I happen to already support. My beliefs aren't going to be swayed because an artist whose work I appreciate feels a certain way. The only thing that might happen when an artist I respect and whose work I appreciate waxes political, is that could wind up irritating me, disappointing me, offending me, or cause me to lose respect, which might influence a lessening of interest or patronage on my behalf.

Why risk any of that? Let politicians politick.

This is an excellent perspective and I agree with essentially everything in this post. I believe Gord's lyrics support your position in the sense they are not explicitly related to a political agenda. However, the boys do elicit enough (inter?)national attention to be considered as more than just an on-stage and recording band. Their political sentiments inevitably percolate into a wider spectrum of their commercial art, there are countless examples of this. I suspect for some listeners there are broader themes to be explored. For example, before NFPA I would be interested to know how many Hip fans knew there was a place called Attawapiskat, let alone how to pronounce it, where it is and the political and cultural challenges the community faces. One may or may not agree with First Nation's plight but the fact the band delivered this content is testament to their desire to raise our level of awareness and consciousness on the issues. Having said that I can assure that travelling to Vegas from Toronto to enjoy 2 hours of sonic bliss has little to do with this, but having a side line discussion on the political themes we interpret from this band is not a bad thing either.