I have seen The Hip easily fill 19,000 people arenas where everyone is on their feet and screaming their heads off.....
And so far at the less than 3,000 person Massey Hall there's SO MANY people sitting down, leaving less than half-way through the show... And I'm even hearing lots of "this show sucks" and stuff like that around the concession stands and outside.
Now... Let me just say that I like WATS, but I would be the first to tell you that most of the songs from it are just not good live. It seems as if many of you guys have been going on as to how great they are live, and I'm not debating that. It's clear that The Hip do everything better live than they do on the album... However I just think the songs on WATS, while performed well, do not have any energy, flow, or live feel.
I'm not saying it is just WATS that is causing this stuff, but certainly it seems like everytime one of them (aside from Depression) is played, everyone leaves or sits down. Last night was the worst I have ever seen. Even some classics like Grace and Fireworks weren't enough to send the place into a frenzy like a proper Toronto Hip show should be. I was 4th row floors in the centre, and the WHOLE row in front of me was empty for over 50% of the show. There were at least 10 empty seats in a row.
What are your thoughts guys? Could it be the new songs? Could it be the setlists? Could it be that Gord isn't as animated as he was in the past?
I really bugs me to see this kind of stuff. I was expecting the best band + the best venue to be the most amazing run of shows ever but I have left every night so far feeling down on the atmosphere
It's Toronto! That's the problem.
The crowd in Montreal and Boston were into every song, the Kitchener crowds were ok but not even close to them.
People are too worried about how they look, it's all the crowds attitude not the music being played.
Wait and watch the crowds in Buffalo, Hamilton and Detroit
Ouch....tell me it isn't true!
I witnessed this during Bob Dylan's show last year. It was ridiculous. I had an 80 dollar seat and practically my entire section vacated. I never understood that, not only was the show just fine and dandy but what do you expect, exactly? Do the masses expect the band to not play any new songs and for the frontman, in this case Bob Dylan, to sound like he's 25?
I think if I witnessed that for the Hip in Winnipeg I would cry. And I'm going to 3 shows so I might have a breakdown of some sort.
I disagree guys, I was on the floor in the back section under the balcony roof, so I got a full view of the first 26 rows or so, and there was some serious energy, especially near the end of the first set and very much into the second. I agree that there wasn't as much energy for the WATS stuff, but you have to agree that when they cranked out so much from phantom power, DFN, TITHH ect. the place got very hyped.
Also, maybe it's just me (24), I noticed a much older crowd than usual- maybe that could be the difference...
All in all, a total blast, I thought they were amazing as usual- especially taking cell phones away from people in the front rows- I hate that shit at concerts!
It's one thing if attendance is spotty, or people are feeling that the shows "suck".
It's another thing entirely if crowds appear "subdued" to the observer, such as lots of sitting and being relatively quiet. I'm one of those who usually sits and listens, and do nothing more than simply applaud after a song ends. I never really understood the whole yell-and-scream-and-jump-and-bounce at concerts anyway; how can you truly listen and be moved by the music if you're shouting during the song?
Also, I think the fan base is aging along with this band, which translates to more subdued audiences.
1. Toronto audiences - I'm from Toronto - for the most part Toronto audiences appear to be apathetic at best - any band that comes here will tell you - they love playing in Toronto but the audiences kind of suck compared to everywhere else.
2. Higher ticket prices may have more casual fans with more money proportional to an arena show. Even if say 30% are casual fans - 30% of 3000 is 900 leaving 2100 rabid fans vs. 30% of 15000 being 4500 leaving 10500 rabid fans = a lot more noise at a larger venue - though I was at Marillion a few weeks ago in Montreal and the 2500 fans there were louder during the parts that were only "OK" than at any point at Massey Hall the past 2 nights - not that there were any just "OK" parts of either Marillion or Hip shows.
3. The acoustic nature to a lot of the new songs - though performed well - do tend to drop the energy in a way that other midtempo ones don't - such as Escape, Don't Wake Daddy etc.
I feel that maybe because there are 6 shows, 3 in Kitchener, 3 in Hamilton, London, Kingston, Montreal, etc... Coupled with the fact that the shows were overpriced and that there hasn't been a big hit from this album to build the tour up, I just feel like a lot of the tickets went to casual people that said "hey let's go to a concert on a spring night".
Not being hardcore fans, they are all ready to sit or leave after 10 songs.
At the $107 price point there are some different types of people attending the shows.
FRont row first night was borderline boring... I mean we should have been crammed against Gord's boat up there...but know everyone held there spot 3 inches infront of the front seat.
You have a point...there has been many times in arena shows I've seen Gord pick the audience up and throw them against the wall with control... and these crowds don't seem to want to jump from the chairs...
It does affect the overall mood of the show to a certain degree.. makes me think of sneaking in a Rochester and maybe a Hamilton ?
AS for the new songs live...well first off most of the people sitting down haven't bought a Hip album since Music At Work... so they don't know the new songs live... like a hardcore fan who had the CD memorized a week after release.
A couple of the new tunes are a little suspect for me live... and a couple come off real strong like Love Is A Curse, Frozen and my favourite The Depression Suite. The Suite is one of the Hip's finer deliveries of their entire career. I like everything about it...from the layers to the lyrics, the bass line, the keys, the journey and the fact that most radio fans probably won't like this one... I could go on longer about how well Live it is... I get nervous thinking they might not play it tonight.
Yeah, the ticket prices are a good point- looking forward to Hammer!!
Depression Suite is stellar live - though I think it works better at the end of the set than the beginning
I am going tonight so we will see...But I will tell you the Music Hall was nuts I was 4th row no one sitting there, then again a different fan hardcore :thumb:
The Horrible Esthete Wrote:It's one thing if attendance is spotty, or people are feeling that the shows "suck".
It's another thing entirely if crowds appear "subdued" to the observer, such as lots of sitting and being relatively quiet. I'm one of those who usually sits and listens, and do nothing more than simply applaud after a song ends. I never really understood the whole yell-and-scream-and-jump-and-bounce at concerts anyway; how can you truly listen and be moved by the music if you're shouting during the song?
Also, I think the fan base is aging along with this band, which translates to more subdued audiences.
I totally agree with this. When I was 18 and seeing the Hip for the first time, I was constantly dancing, jumping up and down, yelling my lungs out, and crowd surfing. Now I'm 34 and I just don't have the energy for that stuff anymore. Don't get me wrong, I still yell and applaud when the song ends, and I can still get my groove on when I want to. But after being on my feet for 9 hours at work all day, it's tough to remain standing for the duration of a 2 1/2 hour concert during the evening. If it's a seated theatre show, sometimes I just need to sit down for a couple of songs and rest my poor legs. It doesn't mean I'm not enthusiastic about the band or the music. It just means I'm freakin' tired.
Oh, and I also agree that Toronto crowds suck for the most part. I've seen quite a few shows there over the years by different bands, and the crowds are always pretty subdued. Everytime I've seen the Hip here in Calgary, the crowds have been absolutely insane. I think Dave Bidini summed it up best in his excellent book "On a Cold Road":
"In Toronto, fans applaud; in Vancouver, they cheer; but in Calgary, they howl hair-raising guttural paroxysms of zeal."
thecompletist Wrote:At the $107 price point there are some different types of people attending the shows.
FRont row first night was borderline boring... I mean we should have been crammed against Gord's boat up there...but know everyone held there spot 3 inches infront of the front seat.
You have a point...there has been many times in arena shows I've seen Gord pick the audience up and throw them against the wall with control... and these crowds don't seem to want to jump from the chairs...
It does affect the overall mood of the show to a certain degree.. makes me think of sneaking in a Rochester and maybe a Hamilton ?
AS for the new songs live...well first off most of the people sitting down haven't bought a Hip album since Music At Work... so they don't know the new songs live... like a hardcore fan who had the CD memorized a week after release.
A couple of the new tunes are a little suspect for me live... and a couple come off real strong like Love Is A Curse, Frozen and my favourite The Depression Suite. The Suite is one of the Hip's finer deliveries of their entire career. I like everything about it...from the layers to the lyrics, the bass line, the keys, the journey and the fact that most radio fans probably won't like this one... I could go on longer about how well Live it is... I get nervous thinking they might not play it tonight.
HOLY FUCK IT'S JESUS!!!!!!!!!! 107 BUCKS??!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WOW........... no wonder people aren't as enthusiastic.
Seattle shows are always great - lots of people cross the border to come down for them and tickets are about a third of the price, even with the exchange.
I bet that's yer answer right there. The prices coupled with the crap economy and the fact they are playing a ton of shows in a relatively small area.
Why are they that expensive up there? I know everything is in Canada compared with the U.S. but still............. that is a huge difference. Is it because they just CAN?!!!
VioletLite Wrote:Why are they that expensive up there? I know everything is in Canada compared with the U.S. but still............. that is a huge difference. Is it because they just CAN?!!!
Yup, pretty much. They're still arguably the biggest concert draw in this country in terms of homegrown rock bands, so the demand is there. I agree the prices for these shows are a little ridiculous, which is why I didn't bother getting tickets for the Canadian tour this time around. Luckily I'm taking a vacation to California in June, and I only paid $30/ticket to see them on back-to-back nights at the Fillmore in San Francisco. Woohoo!
Has anyone considered the fact The Hip have been described many times as "BEER ROCK" and that Massey Hall is essentially a "DRY" Venue. Unless their rules of no food or drinks in the auditorium has been changed I believe this to be a major factor. People leave I am sure to run down to the bar for another round of drinks before the intermission. Unless the intermission runs more than 30 mins. there is no time to buy one drink it and get back to your seat in time for the second set. Secondly these are "an evening with" concerts in seated theaters finally giving people a chance to actually sit and relax while the music sinks in. After 8 years of large indoor/outdoor "party" type atmospheres we finally have a chance to sit and I hope everyone on Sat. night takes advantage of this, as I intend to.